I am about to buy an M8!

[raid]

Originally Posted by Mudman

Raid - KEH includes a 6 month warranty on all used gear.

This may be the way to go.
I had found a very clean M8 here at RFF, but the buy did not work out.
The other alternative is to buy from a dealer.

[raid]

Originally Posted by tajart

Please keep us posted when you get one, etc.
I use the plain old M8 and really enjoy it for my kind of shooting. The last firmware upgrade eliminated the one problem I had before, which was locking up when shooting in continuous mode (which is not a mode I actually use or need). I have mine set on "silent mode" (I think that is what it is called). I've enjoyed using my Leica and CV glass on it, and find the 25/4 on it a lot.
TomJ

Hi Tom,
I was targeting M8 cameras with lower than 2000 actuations, and they are hard to find. I have been contacted by quite a few RFF members about buying their M8 or M8.2 cameras, but so far we have not reached any agreements.

[Mudman]

To be honest, I've been flip flopping on buying another m8. Loved the camera, but don't know if I can justify having it again.

[Peter Klein]

Raid: I think you're going to love the M8. I bought mine new in early 2007, once all the quirks were known. I've never regretted it. The 1.3x crop never bothered me. I was a 50mm person with film cameras, so I simply started using a 35mm lens as my "normal." In fact, in some ways I like the slightly wider view of the 35mm lenses on the M8 than I do the standard 50mm view on film. I can still use my 50mm lenses, they have just become mild telephotos (or portrait lenses). Each lens retains its general personality, it just becomes one "notch" longer in magnification, and you lose the aberrations in the far corners.

Since you have a fair number of lenses, you'll probably be just fine. I would advise getting enough IR cut filters so that you don't have to change filters frequently while shooting (i.e. have a filter for each of your most-used lenses). The IR filters are very necessary to prevent the dreaded magenta cast. Even in B&W, pictures with the filters are sharper. There may be some advantage to shooting B&W filterless in low tungsten light. Once you have the filters, you simply forget about them and all's well. The only time they bother me is when shooting into a bright light source, where they can cause ghost reflections.

Focus is more critical than on film. Check your lenses wide-open focusing at infinty and at a meter or two. If a lens is consistently off, send it to DAG or Leica to be tweaked to M8 standards.

I use the original 35/1.4 Summilux ASPH (without the floating element). You may detect a slight rearward focus shift on some fast lenses as you stop down. This is an optical property of the lens design, not a lens defect. It usually happens starting at f/2.8, and by f/8 depth of field takes care of it. I just focus on the closest thing I want in focus between f/2.8 and 5.6, and/or tweak the focus a hard closer at those apertures. No big deal.

Sure, I'd love to have a sensor with the low-light ability of a D700 or K-5 in an M body. That may be coming at Photokina. But since that will probably cost $8K or more, it just isn't in the cards for me. The M8 actually does as well or better than film at ISO 640, and that's often enough with an f/1.4 lens. ISO 1250 is fine for B&W conversion if you expose properly. Meanwhile, you'll have all the conveniences of digital and rangefinder shooting.

You will want to code lenses of 28mm and shorter. A "Milich" or Voigtlander Type II adapter works well for screw-mount lenses. M-Mount lenses can sometimes be coded with a Sharpie marker pen and a "coder kit" template, or you can send it to DAG, and he will do it. 50mm lenses and longer don't need to be coded, unless you need the focal length to be in the EXIF. 35mm lenses are a toss-up. You will get very slightly cyan-shifted corners if you don't code them, but it's often not noticeable. CornerFix software or even a home-made gradient can solve the cyan shift without coding, but coding is far more convenient. Unlike the M9, the M8 does not have a way of manually entering the focal length in a menu.

Shoot RAW. The M8 (and M9) JPGs are not the best. I use Capture One. Some people prefer Lightroom. If you have a Mac, ask somebody else. :-) When you expose, bear in mind that the M8 has most of its latitude in the shadows, not the highlights.

If you were primarily or exclusively an "available dark" shooter, or mostly shot extreme wide-angle, the M8 wouldn't be right for you. But given what I know about you and your pictures, I think you'll be just fine.

--Peter

[raid]

Thanks for the detailed advices, Peter.
I will try to make use of them once I find myself a clean M8.
I already like how 50mm lenses look with a 2x crop factor on the EP-2.
A 50/2 looks like a 100/2 but with DOF of a 50mm/2 lens. It is more forgiving for portraits. I do not get anymore either the tip of the nose or the eye lashes in focus.

[Jubb Jubb]

@Raid - check Popflash as well.

This M8 looks nice, and has under 2000 actuations, + 30 day warranty.

http://www.popflash.com/leica-digita...irmware-2.014/

[raid]

I know about this ad, and I contacted Alex at popflash about the two M8 cameras. Then I found an M8 with fewer than 500 actuations, and I was "side-tracked"! The buy did not occur, and I am back to searching for a very clean M8 or get a warranty. Another RFF member kindly offered me his own "one month trial warranty", so to speak. I found this to be very nice.

[raid]

I missed getting a 300 actuations $1900 M8 on FredMiranda. It was sold this morning.
What a bummer.

[Dante_Stella]

Originally Posted by raid

I missed getting a 300 actuations $1900 M8 on FredMiranda. It was sold this morning.
What a bummer.

Low actuations on a camera that old, like low miles on an old car, are usually a sign that things have not been debugged. Or that the camera is a dud.

Dante

[tmfabian]

Originally Posted by Dante_Stella

Low actuations on a camera that old, like low miles on an old car, are usually a sign that things have not been debugged. Or that the camera is a dud.

Dante

I dunno...I got me an '89 Porsche with 2k miles on it, and it's gone on to win several concourse events. That being said, proper care of low usage items is more important than the actual usage.

[raid]

Originally Posted by Dante_Stella

Low actuations on a camera that old, like low miles on an old car, are usually a sign that things have not been debugged. Or that the camera is a dud.

Dante

Hi Dante,
Your point is well taken and very timely as I am getting some offers from M8 owners.

[coelacanth]

Originally Posted by Dante_Stella

Low actuations on a camera that old, like low miles on an old car, are usually a sign that things have not been debugged. Or that the camera is a dud.

Dante

I had that impression on super low actuation ones. I was aiming for 2k-7k range.

300 actuation on M8 is like a 6 years old motorcycle without 500 mile service done. (sorry I'm an MC guy so easier to think this way) You just don't know what's hidden.

I went with an M8.2 with 4.8k actuations in the end.

[raid]

Is the M8.2 worth the extra $600-$1000?

[twopointeight]

Don't overemphasize actuations. My M8.2 came brassy with 20,000 actuations and I put on another 10,000. Never a problem. Like a car's mileage, 50,000+ miles is nothing for a well maintained vehicle, especially a German one. And yes, IMO the M8.2 is worth the extra cost. It's sorted out.

[raid]

So the 1/8000 sec speed is not really that important?
How about the IR sensitivity; do both M8 types have the capability of IR photography?

[coelacanth]

Originally Posted by raid

Is the M8.2 worth the extra $600-$1000?

Personally, yes. Personally.

I really really like quiet shutters in general. Quieter the better. M8 shutter was very loud in my opinion especially coming from film Ms. I don't need 1/8000 shutter speed so much preferred quieter, less vibrating shutter.

Also, though I understand many M8s are working just fine, M8.2s in general have lower milage with all small improvements in place. Not saying M8.2 is bullet proof, though.

More accurate frame lines for general situation could be a plus for many. I believe M8.2 is the only one having 2m optimized FL (M8 0.7m) in digital M family, and it's closer to my favorite user, M2. Some people might prefer M8 version, but if you are doing street/landscape work, M8.2's FL could be better choice. To me, it's not a deal breaker either way, but the more M2 ish the better.

Oh and black paint, vulcanite-ish covering, and black dot make the camera a little more classic and classy... I for one not the biggest fan of red dot so... It's ALMOST as discreet as M9P/MP.

M8.2 is like Rev. B of Apple product, or a car 1-3 years after the full model change (M7 to M8 in this extreme case). If I was rich enough to buy M8 when it originally came out, I wouldn't have cared being "beta tester" and wouldn't have waited till "Rev B" model came out, but since both M8 and M8.2 are out there today, I'd choose Rev B instead of the very first model.

Just my $0.02.

[setyotomo]

Go for it, if you dont like it ... Sell it.. Life to short

[raid]

I am looking for a decent offer to buy. KEH gves a six month warranty.

[willie_901]

Both have the same IR sensitivity and IR filters are not optional for color images

[jwicaksana]

Very interesting thread and great advices here.
Best wishes for your quest, Raid.

[Lss]

Originally Posted by raid

Is the M8.2 worth the extra $600-$1000?

I bought an upgraded M8 for the price of a regular M8 at a time when the price difference between M8 and M8.2 (especially here in Euro zone) was more significant than it is now. There are many upgraded M8's around, so make sure to look for one if you find the M8.2 interesting.

[raid]

I have been contacted by three M8 owners this morning, and two of them offer upgraded M8's. One of the offers has 4k actuations and it has been regularly maintained by Leica over the years. The upgrade did not include the Saphire back. Cost is $2400, still in box sealed by Leica from last maintenance. The other is M8.2 fully upgraded, and its costs $2800. A third offer is from Spain, and I may be abtter off to buy in the USA.

I am seeing two good offers.

[ChrisC]

Originally Posted by raid

So the 1/8000 sec speed is not really that important?.....

Only for bokeh perverts, otherwise the price you pay for that absurd shutter speed is considerably more energy going into it's acceleration and deceleration, resulting in a noisier shutter, and possibly [as many have speculated] a less robust shutter. I seem to recall that Mark Norton on LUF [his 'Anatomy of an M8' thread is essential reading] later observed a modification to the M8.2 shutter mounting which would also help dampen shutter noise.

The only M8.2 I've tried alongside my M8 was noticeably quieter to me, and the framelines were an improvement. If buying now, I think I would prefer to buy from a good dealer if possible, and would pay extra for an M8.2. Make sure you handle the camera, you might also inspect for a gritty shutter release [mine's gritty, and technically speaking; irritatingly crappy workmanship].

Actually I'd pay extra for an even quieter 1/2000 sec shutter, if it existed, or even better; a traditional cloth shutter. ............. I know, I know....

.......... Chris

[raid]

KEH offers a six month warranty, and they have M8 cameras fopr sale. The M8.2 is considerably more expensive with any camera dealer. Private sellers ask for about $2800 for a clean M8.2. without a warranty.

[raid]

I just sent the owner of an updated M8 an email that I want to buy his camera. I learned a lot about buying an M8 from all of your experience sharing here. Thanks.