Nikon D800 as a "Scanner"

Michel154 · 10-12-2012

Hi this is my first post here and English in not my native language so be gentle .
firs let me introduce myself .i'm Michel French for Michael
i am a profesional photographer ,mostly product and advertising .
for work i use digital cameras of all sorts ,film is mostly for myself and personal projects ,i always had a "problem" scanning ,what i mean is that it is slow and Expensive ,i unfortunately don't use my dark room as much as i would like,
so looking trough my old stuff i found my bellows PB-6 for Nikon
and used the slide copy gizmo+the old macro 55 and guess what, i am very happy with the results
i used it on a Nikon D800 , i found the dynamic range to be superb i get great subtlety in my tonal-range much better that my epson or coolscan
it is also much faster 2 sec exposures
fell free to look at mu flickr page for some samples

hope this might help someone

Matus · 10-12-2012

Hello Michael. First of all let me say that you have some nice work on Flickr (in particular that motorbike shot). You seem to get the handle of the digitizing with D800. May I ask which 'slide copy gizmo' it is that you used?

Michel154 · 10-12-2012

it is the Bellows PB-6 with the slide copying adapter

Vics · 10-12-2012

WOW! (oh, et bienvenue, Michel) I have one of those, but mine is the old one, the Model II, new in the boxes with the slide copier! I never thought of doing that. I wonder what the least nikon mount digicam is that I could use like that? Maybe get a used D40? I'm all film, so...

Matus · 10-12-2012

Was there ever such a slide copying stuff for 6x6? That would make me seriously think ...

Michel154 · 10-12-2012

6x6 would be nice ,maybe taping the negative to a window or light table

Vics · 10-12-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matus

Was there ever such a slide copying stuff for 6x6? That would make me seriously think ...

On page 291 of The Hasselblad Manual Wildi there is a bellows with a slide copying attachment shown. You may have to bash something together if you're thinking of using it with a regular DSLR.

Vics · 10-12-2012

It's like a 21st century Pete Turner kind of thing! Pete used to shoot on Kodacxhrome, then copy the original slide in his PB-6, adding filtration as he copied. Total Nikon guy:
http://www.peteturner.com/Classics/index.html

nanthor · 10-12-2012

I've done this before via a couple methods. One was with a film copying machine made by Beseler, great results but a pain to set it up and attach a camera, focus was iffy, etc. The other method is just using a light table and a piece of ANR glass to hold the negative or slide down, fast and easy but the results weren't equal to a scanner due to the camera limited in megapixels. I can imagine the D800 gives great results due to the larger imager and pixel number. As far as finding slide copying devices there are generic ones on the 'bay for 35mm and I think I've even seen larger ones for 6x6 occasionally. They're cheap compared to the higher quality of the older dedicated bellows for name brand systems but they look like they'd work well enough for fast and dirty digitizing.

nanthor · 10-12-2012

Michel, I just looked over your pics done with this routine, VERY nice. It makes me upset that I recently sold my M7 in lieu of an M9 so now all my 35mm will be digital. My M9 will never be able to replicate that film look. There's a presence there that only film provides. Maybe I should sell the M9, by back into an M7, and have thousands left for film. Hmm.

Michel154 · 10-12-2012

i sold my M9 to get the D800 but kept my M7 ,
i loved the M9 one of the greatest cameras i have ever owned , i think you will be very happy with it

x-ray · 10-12-2012

I've done this with my Hasselblad and digital back copying 8x10 and 5x7 B&W negs. I just tape the neg to a light box. put the camera on a tripod or studio stand above it and level both the camera and light box. I use a macro for a flat field and stop down two or three stops for best resolution. I mask around the neg with black tape and black paper to keep stay light out and then shoot my best exposure. Any good DSLR should work. It would pork fine for color transparencies too. I'll probably give the D800 a try too with my old micro 55 f3.5.

MartinP · 10-12-2012

I have been holding the film strip in the neg holder from my enlarger, with a bit of black paper forming an anti-glare chimney on top, and putting a K5 (and old 50mm f4 macro lens) on a tripod above the neg. Using a bellows and copy-holder should mean much better alignment and control of unwanted light. Excellent alternative to flatbeds

Michel154 · 10-12-2012

micro 55 f3.5. is what i have used ,it is a bit soft in the corners but around f11 it is ok
what i like about this process it the detail ,it is just amazing ,

Michel154 · 10-12-2012

here is a 100% crop of one of the photos

RFH · 10-12-2012

Very impressive results, I must say. The tonality is great. Much better than what I've seen in my own B&W scans. Grain looks good.

Dwig · 10-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by nanthor

...The other method is just using a light table and a piece of ANR glass to hold the negative or slide down, fast and easy but the results weren't equal to a scanner due to the camera limited in megapixels. ...

Megapixels haven't been a limitation for this method in a long long time. A 12mp camera is the pixel equivalent of a roughly 3000ppi scan. The big limitation has been dynamic range. Also, you should NEVER EVER shoot/scan through ANR glass, period. Such glass should only every be used on the illumination side of the carrier. Shooting through it willl always lower resolution.

Back in the day, I used a 2mp Nikon CoolPix 950 along with its slide/neg copier attachment. Resolution was great for web use. A full screen "scan" was easily as sharp has a downsampled scan from a Imagcon (something I use at work regularily, btw). The difference was solely in the amount of deep shadow and delicate highlight detail. I've since moved to an Epson v700.

The recent improvements in sensors' dynamic range, particularily in the sensor used in the D800, move this type of "scanning" much much closer to the high end rather than the "only quickies for the web" class it is limited to with lower performing sensors. The limitation now is largely the lens used.

ColSebastianMoran · 10-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matus

Was there ever such a slide copying stuff for 6x6? That would make me seriously think ...

Besseler Dual Mode Slide Duplicator for 6x6 and 6x7. Nice rig. Add your camera and lens.

Michel154 · 10-13-2012

the sensor in the D800 is amazing the "scans" are so much better than the ones from my V700 or the coolscan which has a old CCD from a few years back ,
the shadow detail is there which is not always there with the V700 or coolscan
here is the 100% again

and here is the whole frame

that is not bad one can make a 13x19 print with no problem and this is ISO400

Foto-factotum · 10-13-2012

Please forgive my very basic question: if you shoot a "negative" how much effort/ time is involved to change that to a "positive " It this done afterwards in Photo shop?

A reply will be much appreciated.

Eugene

jtm6 · 10-13-2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Foto-factotum

Please forgive my very basic question: if you shoot a "negative" how much effort/ time is involved to change that to a "positive " It this done afterwards in Photo shop?

A reply will be much appreciated.

Eugene

Image > Adjustments > Invert.
Done.

If you're lazy, you can use a keystroke combo (cmd+I) instead.

Noll · 10-13-2012

Hi Michel, thanks for sharing your method with us, looks like you're getting some great results with it. I think more here should consider the dslr over flatbed scanning. Really, any decent dlsr will do and be faster and sharper than a low-end scanner like the v500. Highly recommended for 35mm. If I may, I'll share a cheaper alternative:

Using an Olympus e510 and 35mm macro at around 1:2 magnification, I set up a tripod, small light box and film holder. After my film dries, but before I cut it, I feed the whole roll through the film holder, taking a shot of each frame along the way. Live view is helpful for focus. This takes about 15 minutes to setup and carry out.

Many used 4/3 bodies go for close to $100 these days. The lens goes for another $160. If a dedicated scanner did this for less than $300, people would flip. As far as I'm concerned, the look and feel of film is all there, and without the frustration of crummy flatbed scans.

It seems blasphemous, but if you go the "hybrid" route on a budget, I bet it gives the V700 a run for its money for much less than what one costs. And you get a decent camera out of the deal.

Disadvantages - The dslr stinks for color negative, and medium format would be a joke. There is also the inversion, crop, and tone post-process work. Biggest disadvantage, though, I'd rather just print a photo in darkroom if I had one...

Foto-factotum · 10-13-2012

Thank you for heads up about the ease of going for negative to positive jtm6 and pkr. ( I was so looking forward to the Plustek 120 scanner, but now I may just invest that dosh in a D800!)

Michel154 · 10-13-2012

hi the workflow is simple , set white balance before inserting the negative ,
frame in Live-view ,focus only once,take photo ,TIFF for me ,
import in Bridge invert in Photoshop (command +i) adjust to levels or curves ,and save

as for the price yes it is 3000 but so is a used coolscan ,
for 35mm this is great plus you can take photos

Michel154 · 10-13-2012

here is a sample of Slide Film Kodak E100