Go Back   Rangefinderforum.com > News

Main Menu
:









old 03-06-2017  
CameraQuest CameraQuest is offline
Head Bartender
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: over the hills from Malibu
Posts: 5,348
Bad Rangefinder Videos by RF Wanabees

Is anyone else appalled by rangefinder videos by wannabee rangefinder experts who don't really know rangefinders?

the sad thing is that their audience knows even less about rangefinders
than the wannabees, so they get taken in by
"experts" who don't know enough to realize how little
they do know about rangefinders.

 




News Jump:
RFF News
« Previous | Next »
You Rated this Thread:

old 03-06-2017
farlymac
PF McFarland
The Internet can make an "expert" out of anybody.

PF
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-06-2017
Ko.Fe.
Me. Write ESL. Ko.
Good video about cameras are not so easy to make. Not only for RF cameras. I'm giving them all one big credit to have courage to talk about it. Even Winogrand was unable to give clear explanation then he was asked why RF.

Best explanation why RF was giving by Meyerowitz so far (to me). It is so natural. It is why I'm RF and not SLR person.
https://youtu.be/Xumo7_JUeMo
And it is genius not just on RF, but what is best in photography (to me).
So after I watched this video, those guys who could barely hold it and unable to take interesting picture with it, are ... nice guys who are at least trying it. They are also doing some write ups about Leica. Like this one.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-06-2017
tunalegs
Pretended Artist
Sometimes even those who know about rangefinders make mistakes when writing about them too.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-06-2017
kb244
Registered User
Are they claiming to be experts?
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-07-2017
DrMcCoy
Registered User
Never seen this. Examples?
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-07-2017
Lss
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Is anyone else appalled by rangefinder videos by wannabee rangefinder experts who don't really know rangefinders?
I have been told that a rangefinder camera cannot be used for video. I am appalled by that comment.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-07-2017
unixrevolution
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lss View Post
I have been told that a rangefinder camera cannot be used for video. I am appalled by that comment.
It can be, but the expense and framerate are pretty terrible
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-07-2017
BillBingham2
Registered User
Where might we find said silliness?

B2 (;-?
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-07-2017
nobbylon
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by farlymac View Post
The Internet can make an "expert" out of anybody.

PF
never a more true word spoken
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
yoyo22
Registered User
I believe that some of those new "reviewers" of Leica rangefinders desire to be discovered by Leica, so that they may get "free stuff" for their reviews.

Recently I stumbled across a video review of the Summilux 35mm asph FLE, which in its entire length said absolutely nothing about the lens, but was a mere presentation of the photographer presenting it. I could not stop watching it though, as the slow motion sequences of the photographer drawing the camera from his bag and snapping uneventful scenes in the metro were somehow mesmerizing.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
nobbylon
Registered User
I don't know how much worth people get out of watching a video review anyway. If I've ever wanted to find out about a camera or lens I've either bought it and used it myself or I've asked on here.
I don't know which video reviews you are talking about but the only ones I've ever watched are done by Kai on digitalrev tv. I don't watch for information but rather for a laugh every now and then.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
nukecoke
⚛Yashica
I've seen one promotion video authorized by / associated with Leica. The photog in the videos claims that "you get what you see from the viewfinder" or things like this. As you can imagine the booing in the comment section..
Even sadder the example shots shown in the video are not even good (I know it is subjective, but they are not even mainstream-ly good, so..)
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
Nikos72
Registered User
Well, that's how it goes these days. Everyone can become an expert. Even worse, there will be at least one naive to follow these "experts".
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
Merlijn53
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Is anyone else appalled by rangefinder videos by wannabee rangefinder experts who don't really know rangefinders?

the sad thing is that their audience knows even less about rangefinders
than the wannabees, so they get taken in by
"experts" who don't know enough to realize how little
they do know about rangefinders.
It's the phenomenon, that Dunning and Kruger got the Nobel prize for.
It happens all over the place :-)
Regards,
Frank
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
yoyo22
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobbylon View Post
I don't know how much worth people get out of watching a video review anyway. If I've ever wanted to find out about a camera or lens I've either bought it and used it myself or I've asked on here.
I don't know which video reviews you are talking about but the only ones I've ever watched are done by Kai on digitalrev tv. I don't watch for information but rather for a laugh every now and then.
Try this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VH1a4dwSu0Y
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
oltimer
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Is anyone else appalled by rangefinder videos by wannabee rangefinder experts who don't really know rangefinders?

the sad thing is that their audience knows even less about rangefinders
than the wannabees, so they get taken in by
"experts" who don't know enough to realize how little
they do know about rangefinders.
Stephen, I know you know great camera equipment; but I realize now your also a great fisherman too.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
nobbylon
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by oltimer View Post
Stephen, I know you know great camera equipment; but I realize now your also a great fisherman too.
now now, 😁
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
nobbylon
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by aperture64 View Post
Good description of RFF.
depends whose opinions you listen to, same as everywhere.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
oftheherd
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
Good video about cameras are not so easy to make. Not only for RF cameras. I'm giving them all one big credit to have courage to talk about it. Even Winogrand was unable to give clear explanation then he was asked why RF.

Best explanation why RF was giving by Meyerowitz so far (to me). It is so natural. It is why I'm RF and not SLR person.
https://youtu.be/Xumo7_JUeMo
And it is genius not just on RF, but what is best in photography (to me).
So after I watched this video, those guys who could barely hold it and unable to take interesting picture with it, are ... nice guys who are at least trying it. They are also doing some write ups about Leica. Like this one.
I guess it is a mindset or early experience prejudice. I started out with cameras that only had a viewfinder, no prism or RF. Then I got a SLR. It was a camera, but interesting in that I could change lenses if I had any others, and I got on film pretty much what I saw in the viewfinder.

Then based on some magazine articles, I decided I must have a fixed lens RF. I got one. By then I did have some other lenses for my SLR, and the RF didn't reach out and grab me. Next I got a Super Press 23. Before I got it, it hadn't dawned on me it was RF. But whatever it took to get those (to me) big negatives. But it was big and heavy.

To this day I don't prefer RF over SLR, even though I use them for whatever reason strikes me to do so. I don't have time to look at the whole youtube video, but I got a lot less interested when he talked about how one can see outside the frame lines. I usually do that before I bring the camera to my eye. That comment alone made it really easy to stop watching.

Nor for me, is there usually any big difference in focusing. I have taken a lot of photos in very dim light. With SLR I learned to go in and out of focus outside the center focusing aid. Or I learned to estimate the distance and set my lens to it, or look for something else that seemed to be the same distance to focus on it. To me, in really dim areas, the RF was only helpful if there was something sufficiently bright to use at the plane I wanted to be focused on. If there wasn't, I was better off with an SLR.

That is what works for me. I had to learn that to get the photos I wanted. It worked for me. But everyone has to find there own way or miss the photo. And sometimes, no matter how I tried, I missed a photo as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by oltimer View Post
Stephen, I know you know great camera equipment; but I realize now your also a great fisherman too.
Funny.

I don't spend much time on youtube period, or any other video source either. I either get books or as someone already mentioned, I ask here if I haven't already read it here.

But I think Stephen is simply voicing frustration at the amount of mis-information on the web, about a subject he obviously both knows a lot about, and cares a lot about. I am so surprised to see everyone jump in to defend the defenseless.

I have yet to see of those who have done so have their own videos.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
B-9
Devin Bro
What about the frustration of people claiming Fuji Xpro is a Rangefinder...

Compound that with "why would you pay 6k$ when you can get a Fuji instead..."

I'm not sure why it's difficult, if it doesn't have a Rangefinder, it's not a Rangefinder...

It is not even a faithful way to describe a cameras exterior, it's lazy! Even PopPhoto lays this garbage on their reviews.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
Mr. Fizzlesticks
Registered User
I think it is psychological. Internet "experts" that aren't really experts are more like the people who know nothing and want to learn. They are easier to relate to. A true professional is so far beyond a beginner there is a problem communicating ideas. Ask me why I use a rangefinder and I will have to think about it because I made the decision so long ago I don't remember off the top of my head "why." That is irrelevant to me.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
mike rosenlof
Insufficient information
Sturgeon's Law: "Ninety percent of everything is crud."
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
nukecoke
⚛Yashica
Quote:
Originally Posted by radi(c)al_cam View Post
Could someone, please, explain?

Urbandictionary was no help
I guess it's like "Phishing" as the hacking term? You throw a bait in OP to lure out people's opinions in this case.

In Chinese networks we call such posts "queueing" (you make people stand in different, usually two, "queues", representing different attitudes to a subject.)
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
farlymac
PF McFarland
Quote:
Originally Posted by B-9 View Post
What about the frustration of people claiming Fuji Xpro is a Rangefinder...

Compound that with "why would you pay 6k$ when you can get a Fuji instead..."

I'm not sure why it's difficult, if it doesn't have a Rangefinder, it's not a Rangefinder...

It is not even a faithful way to describe a cameras exterior, it's lazy! Even PopPhoto lays this garbage on their reviews.
Well, you don't have to worry about Popular Photography anymore, they just went belly up.

PF
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
gdi
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlijn53 View Post
It's the phenomenon, that Dunning and Kruger got the Nobel prize for.
It happens all over the place :-)
Regards,
Frank
Actually they won the "Ig Nobel Prize" for that - big difference!
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
CameraQuest
Head Bartender
Quote:
Originally Posted by DrMcCoy View Post
Never seen this. Examples?
I am talking about the phenomena, not the reviewer.

It bothers me that outright false rangefinder info in so many videos is given out to the unsuspecting as fact because the posters themselves don't know rangefinders - but think they do.


Yes, well done video reviews generally need to be scripted,
but scripts do no good if the reviewer does not know the subject.

Stephen
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
mpaniagua
Registered User
Well this happens in every activity area, not just rangefinders/photography related issues. Internet if full of erroneous/false info, so you would be a fool to trust what you find on in the internet on blind faith. So I dont really see the major damage. On the other hand, I truly believe that people does this on good faith, and, at least on my experience, they are open to corrections, so it make it great, because they can learn something and other people can learn it as well.


Regards.

Marcelo
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
oftheherd
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by farlymac View Post
Well, you don't have to worry about Popular Photography anymore, they just went belly up.

PF
Wow!!!! Hard to believe. But I suppose inevitable since so much can be found on the internet. It's probably a wonder it managed to last so long after Modern Photography ceased some years ago. Modern and Popular were favorites of mine for many years. I learned a lot from reading them. I stayed with Popular's forum for some time, but they became too digital-centric after a while and I lost interest. I suppose the next thing you will tell me is that Kodachrome will go away too ...

Sad.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-08-2017
Ko.Fe.
Me. Write ESL. Ko.
Quote:
Originally Posted by oftheherd View Post
...
But I think Stephen is simply voicing frustration at the amount of mis-information on the web, about a subject he obviously both knows a lot about, and cares a lot about. I am so surprised to see everyone jump in to defend the defenseless.

I have yet to see of those who have done so have their own videos.
Well, I have yet to see video where reviewer makes statements what he is RF expert. But, I prefer reading and looking at pictures, not video. I read and understand much more faster than few minutes video.

If light is too dim to focus, I don't use RF, SLR. I use DSLR with AF assisted by TTL flash. It works in total darkness as well.

As for framing it is personal, I can't frame it without frame. I have to have it into my right eye, while left one is to see where I'm walking. With SLR I simply have no left eye option and it doesn't feel secure while walking or even stopping for quick second.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-11-2017
DrMcCoy
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
I am talking about the phenomena, not the reviewer.

It bothers me that outright false rangefinder info in so many videos is given out to the unsuspecting as fact because the posters themselves don't know rangefinders - but think they do.


Yes, well done video reviews generally need to be scripted,
but scripts do no good if the reviewer does not know the subject.

Stephen
Yeah but I've never seen this phenomena. What kind of 'false info' do you mean?

I can't even imagine what people would screw up?
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-11-2017
jarski
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by nobbylon View Post
I don't know how much worth people get out of watching a video review anyway.
That's the single biggest phenomenon right now IMO. Many photogs turn to youtubers because the views (and with views, advertising money) they get from this channel.

DPR seems moving to this direction too, least trying. people rather watch review videos than websites with spec sheets and boring test photos.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-12-2017
Richard G
Registered User
Quote:
Originally Posted by yoyo22 View Post
My God. Going down that escalator and then the stairs I was descending with him to one of the lower circles of Hell. "The Summilux range" - that's a new concept. I had to stop at half way through, just after the long black interval which I had hoped was the final immolation, but wasn't. His team is good, his courage is great but I just don't care and climbed back up out.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-12-2017
Richard G
Registered User
It's terrible that when you want to find how to do something online there's never a simple instruction or diagram but only a YouTube video. The same dreadful camera work and the excessively long introduction that forces you back to the search page for more futile exploration.
Report Post  
Edit
old 03-12-2017
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nukecoke View Post
I guess it's like "Phishing" as the hacking term? You throw a bait in OP to lure out people's opinions in this case.

In Chinese networks we call such posts "queueing" (you make people stand in different, usually two, "queues", representing different attitudes to a subject.)
I think the "fisherman" comment was alluding to Trolling. Trolling, in fishing, is a technique where you keep the boat moving, usually with an electric motor (commonly called a "Trolling Motor), while you drag baited hooks behind the boat.
Report Post  
Edit
old 4 Days Ago
fitou143@gmail.com
fitou143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ko.Fe. View Post
Good video about cameras are not so easy to make. Not only for RF cameras. I'm giving them all one big credit to have courage to talk about it. Even Winogrand was unable to give clear explanation then he was asked why RF.

Best explanation why RF was giving by Meyerowitz so far (to me). It is so natural. It is why I'm RF and not SLR person.
https://youtu.be/Xumo7_JUeMo
And it is genius not just on RF, but what is best in photography (to me).
So after I watched this video, those guys who could barely hold it and unable to take interesting picture with it, are ... nice guys who are at least trying it. They are also doing some write ups about Leica. Like this one.
Interesting video thanks for sharing, food for thought.
Report Post  
Edit
old 3 Days Ago
dmr
Registered Abuser
Quote:
Originally Posted by CameraQuest View Post
Is anyone else appalled by rangefinder videos by wannabee rangefinder experts who don't really know rangefinders?
Not really appalled, more like amused at times. Lots of opinion presented as fact along with blatant misinformation.

For some reason, some look upon videos as more authentic and authoritative than, say, a blog write-up.
Report Post  
Edit
old 3 Days Ago
PunkFunkDunk
Registered User
Steve Huff and will puff and will blow your SLR down.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Report Post  
Edit
old 3 Days Ago
aizan
Registered User
people want to cash in on making youtube videos because people will watch them even if the content is questionable. it's still fun to watch a noob make a fool of himself and call them out in the comments. so there are two sides to the phenomenon. you've got content makers with a financial incentive to overlook their own dilettantism, and a website with features that allow audiences to get some sort of entertainment out of it (which emboldens dilettantes to become content makers in the first place).

i don't think i've seen anyone trying to be misleading, so that's something. they've just been a little uninformed. at least we're not dealing with a fake news and information literacy crisis.

making a watchable video is very difficult, so it's pretty common to see style take precedence over substance. i've watched plenty of videos of a brit with a fuji x100t just because he has a nice time on the weekend. i just finished grad school, so those were few and far between.
Report Post  
Edit
old 3 Days Ago
css9450
Registered User
This phenomenon is not unusual. Educate yourself on a subject - any subject - and you will find almost all that's "out there" in the media is pretty much bare bones at best, or outright wrong at worst.
Report Post  
Edit
 

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

RangeFinderForum > News


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 00:35.


vBulletin skin developed by: eXtremepixels