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-   -   Sigma Foveon full frame L-mount camera in 2019 (http://www.rangefinderforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=166335)

lynnb 09-25-2018 13:35

Sigma Foveon full frame L-mount camera in 2019
 
Sigma has announced (DPReview's Photokina 2018 news) it will release a full frame Foveon sensor model in 2019 in the new Leica-Panasonic-Sigma L-mount (discussed elsewhere in this thread). Native Sigma L-mount lenses (as yet unspecified) will be released at the same time.

Sigma will also produce a Canon EF to L-mount adapter.

Looks like the wishes of quite a few on this Forum are about to be granted - Leica lenses on a full frame Foveon sensor.

Edit: from the same article, "Sigma CEO Kazuto Yamaki... said the company would not create any more cameras using its proprietary SA mount. However, existing SA-mount users will not be left out in the cold: the company will be able to convert some SA mount lenses to L mount. Those who want to retain SA compatibility will alternatively be able to use an SA-L mount adapter."

karateisland 09-25-2018 13:43

Yesssssssss

Timmyjoe 09-25-2018 13:47

That should be interesting.

Best,
-Tim

xayraa33 09-25-2018 13:54

That is sweet news !

Larry H-L 09-26-2018 05:46

It will be interesting to see if they implement auto-crop modes to APS-c and APS-h, as many of the newer lenses for the SD Quattro cameras, such as the 30mm f1.4, wll not cover a full-frame sensor.

gnuyork 09-26-2018 05:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by lynnb (Post 2836695)

Looks like the wishes of quite a few on this Forum are about to be granted - Leica lenses on a full frame Foveon sensor.

I've stopped buying digital cameras for a few years now and concentrating on mainly film photography again... This would tempt me back to the dark side.

benlees 09-26-2018 07:01

I hope their software engineers are up for the task. I must admit I'm unfamiliar with the latest offerings, but using large format would have been faster than using a Merrill.

35photo 09-26-2018 07:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by benlees (Post 2836890)
I hope their software engineers are up for the task. I must admit I'm unfamiliar with the latest offerings, but using large format would have been faster than using a Merrill.

The only problem with the Foveon sensor for me has been the processing... In that you can only use their software... which of course sucks... Unless you like using crappy software then cool otherwise... Its a no go for me.

Fjäll 09-26-2018 08:16

Haven't bought new camera gear since the release of the X-Pro1. This is all I ever wished for.

Archlich 09-26-2018 08:46

It's great but...how many batteries?

benlees 09-26-2018 10:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35photo (Post 2836893)
The only problem with the Foveon sensor for me has been the processing... In that you can only use their software... which of course sucks... Unless you like using crappy software then cool otherwise... Its a no go for me.

I should be clear I meant in camera processing and RAW conversion at the computer. Slow+slow= welcoming an Xpro1 to the family. :D

Forgot to mention battery life!

nukecoke 09-26-2018 11:03

full frame digital film, nice!

Papercut 09-26-2018 13:15

I'll be very interested in this too. Loved Foveon results for a long time, but whether I finally bite will depend on ergos and other "intangible" tangibles of the final product.

AJShepherd 09-26-2018 13:21

Dammit, I only recently bought an SD Quattro, but have to admit I'm stoked for a full frame Foveon.

fireblade 09-26-2018 14:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35photo (Post 2836893)
The only problem with the Foveon sensor for me has been the processing... In that you can only use their software... which of course sucks... Unless you like using crappy software then cool otherwise... Its a no go for me.

Once you do basic adjustments you can send it to your preferred software as a tiff file or whatever file you choose. No drama.
Never understood the "it's too slow" crowd. It is like they have to hurry upstairs to waiting naked partner, or else.
Once instant coffee was invented the world started its decline. :)

shawn 09-26-2018 15:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by 35photo (Post 2836893)
The only problem with the Foveon sensor for me has been the processing... In that you can only use their software... which of course sucks... Unless you like using crappy software then cool otherwise... Its a no go for me.

That actually hasn't been the case for awhile. The Merrill cameras can be processed in Iridient Developer and the sd Quattros can shoot in DNG so you can bypass SPP completely.

Shawn

shawn 09-26-2018 15:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archlich (Post 2836919)
It's great but...how many batteries?

sd Quattros have *dramatically* improved battery life compared to the DPMs. One battery was good for several hundred shots and I feel like life was comparable to Fuji's. The add on grip for the Quattro added 2 more batteries so it could go a long time.

Shawn

shawn 09-26-2018 15:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by benlees (Post 2836890)
I hope their software engineers are up for the task. I must admit I'm unfamiliar with the latest offerings, but using large format would have been faster than using a Merrill.

sd Quattro's were much improved in that regard. AF was still on the slower side but the general operation of the camera never really got in the way like the Merrill's did. For example, RAW writes were about half the time, 7 shot buffer and the camera could be writing out of the buffer while continuing to shoot. The Merrills reset the buffer write if you took a shot while that was going on.

I timed the sd Q H at around 6 fps in continuous mode. EVF was totally blacked out in continuous mode though.

A sd Quattro type body with a short flange distance mount would be a very interesting camera....

Shawn

shawn 09-26-2018 15:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Larry H-L (Post 2836876)
It will be interesting to see if they implement auto-crop modes to APS-c and APS-h, as many of the newer lenses for the SD Quattro cameras, such as the 30mm f1.4, wll not cover a full-frame sensor.

The sd Quattro H already does this with DC mount lenses, and it can be turned off. The L mount support this so it would be surprising if they didn't.

Shawn

benlees 09-26-2018 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by shawn (Post 2837027)
sd Quattro's were much improved in that regard. AF was still on the slower side but the general operation of the camera never really got in the way like the Merrill's did. For example, RAW writes were about half the time, 7 shot buffer and the camera could be writing out of the buffer while continuing to shoot. The Merrills reset the buffer write if you took a shot while that was going on.

I timed the sd Q H at around 6 fps in continuous mode. EVF was totally blacked out in continuous mode though.

A sd Quattro type body with a short flange distance mount would be a very interesting camera....

Shawn


Good to hear. Their use of DNG would simplify things.

Pioneer 09-26-2018 21:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireblade (Post 2837020)
Once you do basic adjustments you can send it to your preferred software as a tiff file or whatever file you choose. No drama.
Never understood the "it's too slow" crowd. It is like they have to hurry upstairs to waiting naked partner, or else.
Once instant coffee was invented the world started its decline. :)

+1

Why everyone is so obsessed with the need for speed in their photography is beyond me. I guess I just don't hold my finger on the trigger long enough. :D

Admittedly I use film far more often than digital, but I also use a Sigma DP3 Merrill and have not had any critical problems. I think battery life is a far bigger issue with the Merrills but the batteries are much smaller than a roll of film and I have no problem carrying as many rolls or batteries as I need.

As for software, I use Sigma Photo Pro to sort my images and then convert the ones I'm interested in. Again, I spend way more time considering the merits of individual photos than Sigma Photo Pro spends converting them. As for speed, Photoshop is no speed demon either.

Whatever, to each his own.

Samouraï 09-27-2018 13:19

I prefer the slow approach of the Sigma Foveon cameras, but the DP Quadros were in no way difficult to operate, and the post-process was hardly a headache if you were shooting JPEGs for previews. The Merrills, on the other hand, especially the SD1, were not nearly as much fun.

I'd go so far as to say that the DP Quadros are my absolute favorite digital cameras to operate because of the extremely quick thumb controls that allowed adjustment of every important setting within very digestible second or two. Closest thing to the simplicity of a rangefinder camera despite having a fully-featured settings list.

A full-frame Foveon is what I've been waiting for, and we'll hopefully see another re-figuring of the Foveon formula, hopefully something more along the lines of the Merrill cameras' 1:1:1 chips, though I had no trouble with the Quadros rendering for my style of photography.

I've been saving for a new system camera (as I've sold everything buy my DPs and film cameras), and was excited about the new Fuji MF cameras, but this takes the cake. I just hope we get some new DP cameras (DP0 in particular) with leaf shutters alongside the new L-mount camera. I'm beyond excited, never thought we'd see this news.

Hope we get A to L adapter for my old Minolta AF glass, too.

enlo 09-27-2018 13:29

sigma soft is very good, just a bit different. you can't crop, you have to compose well instead... it is not the rule that refers to cropping only.

shawn 09-27-2018 13:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Samouraï (Post 2837288)
I prefer the slow approach of the Sigma Foveon cameras, but the DP Quadros were in no way difficult to operate, and the post-process was hardly a headache if you were shooting JPEGs for previews.

No need to shoot Raw+JPEG for reviewing the files. Use Fast Raw Viewer to cull the x3f files directly, it reads the embedded JPEG. And if you are using a Mac there is an extension you can add that lets the finder display the x3fs embedded JPEG directly so you can preview the files just like a JPEG or TIff file.

Shawn

Samouraï 10-06-2018 15:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by shawn (Post 2837293)
No need to shoot Raw+JPEG for reviewing the files. Use Fast Raw Viewer to cull the x3f files directly, it reads the embedded JPEG. And if you are using a Mac there is an extension you can add that lets the finder display the x3fs embedded JPEG directly so you can preview the files just like a JPEG or TIff file.

Shawn

Thank you for the advice, much appreciated. Feel free to PM me about any other Foveon cool development tools or plugins, Mac or Win.

Keith 01-25-2019 13:36

I still look at the images that come out of my DPMs in amazement. This will be very interesting. :)

EdSawyer 04-03-2019 06:54

A few updates I saw recently:

it will use the 1:1:1 design of the Merrill sensor we all love, not the 4:4:1 design of the Quattro.

Total resolution is supposed to be something like 60mp, but that's using Sigmas way of calculating, so the actual MP count of a single layer will be around 20mp. It should mean larger pixels = better low-light performance.

Samouraï 04-15-2019 07:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by EdSawyer (Post 2879420)
A few updates I saw recently:

it will use the 1:1:1 design of the Merrill sensor we all love, not the 4:4:1 design of the Quattro.

Total resolution is supposed to be something like 60mp, but that's using Sigmas way of calculating, so the actual MP count of a single layer will be around 20mp. It should mean larger pixels = better low-light performance.

Thanks for the update. I found an article noting the same things, except that it is also delayed until 2020.

https://www.l-rumors.com/sigma-annou...09-megapixels/

LeicaFoReVer 07-11-2019 10:26

https://m.dpreview.com/news/67197486...eon-sensor.amp


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