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Old 01-19-2020   #81
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Originally Posted by f.hayek View Post
Wise advice.
The phone camera could be the digital camera here (as a back-up).
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Old 01-19-2020   #82
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Scanning is one problem, albeit somewhat overexaggerated in my opinion. I recently traveled to Southeast Asia with 50 rolls of greatly outdated (2008-2012) films and on returning home, processed it all to my satisfaction. I saw no effects at all from scanning at 6-7 airports, only a very small (+/- 2.5%-5% if even that) level of fog. I ran a test by shooting and processing an equally 'aged' roll I had never taken overseas, and found it was slightly more fogged than my well-traveled stocks. So...

The other problem, in those countries where temperatures tend to run high during the day, is how will you secure your film from heat? ....
For all these reasons, I have decided I won't travel again with film - only digital. I love analog and I intend to go on shooting film at least until my frozen stocks at home are used up, but for me, when I'm on the road, digital is the 21st century way.
I have traveled through India and then to Pakistan and have lost count how many times my films have gone through X-ray machines. In these countries even hotels have scanners at the door and sometimes they insist due to terrorism. With the old scanners I never saw any damage but the new CRT type scanners did damage my 4x5 sheet film at SFO. I am seriously considering digital for US and European travel. Asia hasn’t caught on with the new scanners yet.
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Old 02-11-2020   #83
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Back from my trip, and just ran the films. I had half a roll of HP5+ 135-36 that I had exposed of a white wall at meter reading, one stop under and one stop over in a series of three for the whole roll, save some blank frames at the end. Rewound the film and left the tail out, then went in the darkroom, pulled out about half the roll and loaded in a developing can. Put the second half of the roll, along with an un-exposed roll of 120 HP5 in my Samsonite hard sided cary on roller bag.

First, the C terminal at Logan I went through did not have the new machines in use. My bag got scanned there, and then got a second scan in St Thomas USVI, also with the older type machine. So not any kind of test of the new machines!

Decided at the last minute to shoot the 120 at 800 today to see if there was any noticeable fog from the regular old machine. Deep overcast day here, so the added stop was helpful.

Films are hanging in the dryer and all are completely fine as I would have expected.
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Old 02-11-2020   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rayt View Post
I have traveled through India and then to Pakistan and have lost count how many times my films have gone through X-ray machines. In these countries even hotels have scanners at the door and sometimes they insist due to terrorism. With the old scanners I never saw any damage but the new CRT type scanners did damage my 4x5 sheet film at SFO. I am seriously considering digital for US and European travel. Asia hasnít caught on with the new scanners yet.
Yes. Last year in Delhi, Jaipur, Agra and Shimla every hotel had an old-type scanner (I'm no expert) at the entrance and insisted that every bag and suitcase was put through when we first arrived and every bag every time we came back after a day out. No exceptions.

Thankfully I was using digital not film.
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Old 02-11-2020   #85
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Originally Posted by Rayt View Post
I have traveled through India and then to Pakistan and have lost count how many times my films have gone through X-ray machines. In these countries even hotels have scanners at the door and sometimes they insist due to terrorism. With the old scanners I never saw any damage but the new CRT type scanners did damage my 4x5 sheet film at SFO. I am seriously considering digital for US and European travel. Asia hasnít caught on with the new scanners yet.
I don't see your logic: asking for a hand-check is even easier with these scanners as the TSA agents know that the new scanners are not film safe, so no more arguing with European TSA agents. I the end, these scanners are a plus for us film photographers. When I departed from DCA a few weeks ago, a TSA agent even shouted "If someone has film, please give them to me for a hand inspection!"
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Old 02-11-2020   #86
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I don't see your logic: asking for a hand-check is even easier with these scanners as the TSA agents know that the new scanners are not film safe, so no more arguing with European TSA agents. I the end, these scanners are a plus for us film photographers. When I departed from DCA a few weeks ago, a TSA agent even shouted "If someone has film, please give them to me for a hand inspection!"
It is very different in the US. TSA has been fantastic about film hand inspections.

Abroad? Who knows but I have been refused in England, Germany and Switzerland.
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Old 02-11-2020   #87
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Understood, Huss, but Brian said "I am seriously considering digital for US ..."
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Old 02-11-2020   #88
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Originally Posted by traveler_101 View Post
Yes, there is no cooperation on this side of the Atlantic when it comes to hand checking. I read that LHR is due to get the machines in two years.
They've been rolling out the CT scanners at Heathrow for a few months now. They aren't hard to spot. Ilford posted the following on its FAQ page:

Advice for Airport X-ray scanners: Film & papers

We are working with the DFT and Heathrow airport in the UK and will shortly be updating our information relating to the new CT type x-ray scanners being installed at major airports worldwide.
Based on our initial testing it is almost certain the new CT type x-ray scanners for cabin baggage will be deemed unsafe for any of our ILFORD and KENTMERE film products irrespective of ISO speed rating.

You must therefore ask for hand inspection of your films if the airport is using one of the new type scanners. We will be issuing more specific advice as we complete our testing and evaluation.
How to identify the CT type x-ray scanners

The following machines are currently on the market;
  • Smiths – CTIX
  • L3 – Clearscan
  • Rapiscan - 920CT / Connect CT
  • IDSS - Detect 1000
  • Nuctech - Kylin
  • Analogic Cobra
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Old 02-11-2020   #89
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Originally Posted by Chuck Albertson View Post
They've been rolling out the CT scanners at Heathrow for a few months now. They aren't hard to spot. Ilford posted the following on its FAQ page:


Advice for Airport X-ray scanners: Film & papers

We are working with the DFT and Heathrow airport in the UK and will shortly be updating our information relating to the new CT type x-ray scanners being installed at major airports worldwide.
Based on our initial testing it is almost certain the new CT type x-ray scanners for cabin baggage will be deemed unsafe for any of our ILFORD and KENTMERE film products irrespective of ISO speed rating.


You must therefore ask for hand inspection of your films if the airport is using one of the new type scanners. We will be issuing more specific advice as we complete our testing and evaluation.
How to identify the CT type x-ray scanners

The following machines are currently on the market;
  • Smiths Ė CTIX
  • L3 Ė Clearscan
  • Rapiscan - 920CT / Connect CT
  • IDSS - Detect 1000
  • Nuctech - Kylin
  • Analogic Cobra
Yeah so I wonder if Heathrow will change their policy. Because I have been refused every time I have asked for a hand inspection. And they weren't nice about it...
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Old 02-11-2020   #90
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Huss - same experience for me at Heathrow - can't imagine it will change
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Old 02-12-2020   #91
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Seems the new CT scanners will also destroy instax film.
https://www.fujirumors.com/warning-n...d-instax-film/
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Old 02-12-2020   #92
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Ilford suggests to ask for hand inspection but what if this is refused?
In my opinion inn case of this scanners to have films hand inspected should be a right for the passenger. Or should travelers photographers all go digital?
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Old 02-13-2020   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robert blu View Post
...Or should travelers photographers all go digital?
Certainly now I do.

In the past few years London St Pancras, Paris Gare du Nord and Folkstone Eurostar terminals; London's Heathrow, Gatwick and Stansted airports, airports in Italy, Czechoslovakia, Slovenia, India - all have firmly but politely refused me hand searches when carrying film.

These days I travel with digital only. Carrying film through travel security has become a stressful hassle and lottery I am not going to win.
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Old 02-13-2020   #94
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Originally Posted by Huss View Post
It is very different in the US. TSA has been fantastic about film hand inspections.

Abroad? Who knows but I have been refused in England, Germany and Switzerland.
How our rights have been eroded little by little even in the so-called liberal democracies until we find ourselves indeed in a Brave New World where property and art are subject to destruction by useless security theatrics supported by a cowed populace. Al Qaeda won.

It is in part up to the film manufacturers to pressure these governments now. This is a matter of survival for them. They seem to have totally dropped the ball until now.

It is also up to us as citizens to advocate with our representatives, as opposed to this general throwing up of hands. Jeez, guys and gals in Europe/U.K./Australia/etc.. Write a letter to your MP or something. Last I checked, they were public servants.
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Old 02-13-2020   #95
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I have just returned from a trip to Lisbon and Helsinki. I flew TAP out of JFK terminal 5 to Lisbon, TAP and Finnair from Lisbon to Helsinki, Finnair from Helsinki to Lisbon, and TAP back to JFK. I passed through checkpoints at JFK - terminal 5, Lisbon (twice), and Helsinki. None of them were using the 3D scanners and the film that I have processed so far (Double-x and FP4+) shows no sign of fogging.
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Old 02-14-2020   #96
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Originally Posted by olifaunt View Post
It is in part up to the film manufacturers to pressure these governments now. This is a matter of survival for them. They seem to have totally dropped the ball until now.
I don't think there's much they can do in respect to guaranteeing hand checks. What would be nice is if they could have a presence at major airports. Somewhere to buy film on arrival, and to drop film off prior to departure.

I wonder how much of an impact this will have on film ? I'd imagine most photos are shot whilst people are traveling.

A Fuji X100 or XPro series camera is certainly looking very appealing to me at the moment.
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Old 02-14-2020   #97
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I don't think there's much they can do in respect to guaranteeing hand checks.

Why not? In the U.S. you can get hand checks without problems, so there is an existence proof that it can be done.
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Old 02-14-2020   #98
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Originally Posted by olifaunt View Post
Why not? In the U.S. you can get hand checks without problems, so there is an existence proof that it can be done.
Sure, it could be done... but isn't judging by all the people up thread who've been refused at Heathrow.

I'd probably want a guarantee somewhere that film hand checks will be done before I fly from/to and airport with a CT scanner
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Old 02-14-2020   #99
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Originally Posted by olifaunt View Post
Why not? In the U.S. you can get hand checks without problems, so there is an existence proof that it can be done.
In October 2018 I went through Washington Ronald Reagan and Chicago O'Hare airports machines with a fair amount of Fuji Neopan 400 films in my cabin luggage.

No fogging on my negatives so I guess the new machines hadn't been installed there yet ? Those airports are on "the list" onwards from now. Uhuh.

At Washington Ronald Reagan, that was the control guy himself who kindly asked me if I wanted to benefit from a hand check of films because he had noticed my old Nikon rangefinder camera around my neck, and this was me who politely declined because I had no concerns about my 400 ASA films going through the cabin luggage machines, as usual...

So I can at least confirm that in this airport, hand inspection of films this can be asked and obtained with no hassles.

I wouldn't be that confident about other airports and for instance European airports once the new machines are everywhere.

Monitoring the new machines location and not taking films to go through those airports is the only secure solution that I can think of as for flying.

Other solution is to travel by train instead of by plane. After all, once upon a time it was pretty easy for any destination within a 1,000 km radius. But - the times, they are a changin'...
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Old 02-14-2020   #100
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Sure, it could be done... but isn't judging by all the people up thread who've been refused at Heathrow.

I'd probably want a guarantee somewhere that film hand checks will be done before I fly from/to and airport with a CT scanner
True, but it just means our U.K. citizens can follow the example of their U.S. brethren who successfully advocated for hand checks in the past. They just have some more work to do to make their authorities change their rules. I know it's a monarchy; still, it is not like it is some authoritarian regime where citizens don't have a say, is it?
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Old 02-14-2020   #101
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Use a digital camera for trips in which you must take airplane flights. This is what I suggest.
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Old 02-14-2020   #102
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Use a digital camera for trips in which you must take airplane flights. This is what I suggest.
Nice thought but doesnt work practically for film photographers. I'm not going to switch to digital because of this...
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Old 02-14-2020   #103
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Use a digital camera for trips in which you must take airplane flights. This is what I suggest.
The trips that I get on flights for are the ones that I want to use film the most.

I suggest raising our voices, writing to Ilford, Kodak, Fuji in support of them as they are already aware. The more people stand up, the more likely policies change.
In the USA TSA has actually asked me if I want hand checks.
In the UK signs show film is ok under 800 ISO, so perhaps with lobbying they will change their policies.
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Old 02-14-2020   #104
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Use a digital camera for trips in which you must take airplane flights. This is what I suggest.
This means that you cannot go and take film photos where you go by airplane any longer.

If this is what it means, it also means a severe hit at the film market sooner or later. If this what we want ?
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Old 02-14-2020   #105
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This means that you cannot go and take film photos where you go by airplane any longer.

If this is what it means, it also means a severe hit at the film market sooner or later. If this what we want ?
Raid's suggestion could devastate the film industry.
This is why one does not sit back and accept it.
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Old 02-14-2020   #106
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Sure, it could be done... but isn't judging by all the people up thread who've been refused at Heathrow.

I'd probably want a guarantee somewhere that film hand checks will be done before I fly from/to and airport with a CT scanner
+1. And it must be a clear fact, not an option depending on the personal mood of who is in charge of controls.
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Old 02-14-2020   #107
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The trips that I get on flights for are the ones that I want to use film the most.
Yes!


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Old 02-14-2020   #108
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I feel badly for our friends in the UK and EU. I hope there can be a positive resolution (no pun intended) for the new film destroying CT scanners. I'm not sure how popular instax is with travellers and tourists compared to "traditional" 135, 120, or large format film, but now that Fuji has put out a warning, perhaps that will help the cause.

Here in the US, I flew from San Jose to Denver yesterday for the long weekend. SJC doesn't have the new CT scanners yet, and normally I would have just sent everything through the X-ray machine, but I just wanted to see how amenable TSA employees would be to a request for hand check. I requested hand check for the 5 rolls of 35mm film I was carrying (in a Japan Camera Hunter film case), and had no issues. It was a mix of home bulk-rolled cassettes, and some factory loaded HP5+. I don't think the Denver airport has the new CT scanners either, but I'll report back on my return leg.
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Old 02-14-2020   #109
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Alex Burke, a Colorado-based large format landscape photographer, just put out a blog post sharing his strategy for flying with 4x5 film. Not sure it will work for our friends in the UK/EU, but just sharing for what it's worth:
https://www.alexburkephoto.com/blog/...d-check-labels
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Old 02-14-2020   #110
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Photographers who mainly shoot film need to fight for their rights to carry film across the world. In my own case, I use both types, so I do not mind carrying digital cameras and sometimes one film camera. If the used XRay machines mess up film, this would encourage me to use digital cameras instead. It has nothing to do with my choice destroying the film industry as we know it.
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Old 02-14-2020   #111
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I agree with Raid. I am carrying both digital and film on my trip to Asia at the moment. I prefer the feel of film cameras but recognize the technological advancement of digital. I doubt the world of government bureaucrats concerned with security is going to bend much to the demands of film users since they are so few.

Some have said a M2 with a 35 and TriX is all they need (and that is my favorite combo) but my FujiX100F comes damm close and is much more capable and does not cause worry when passing through an Xray machine.
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Old 02-14-2020   #112
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+1. And it must be a clear fact, not an option depending on the personal mood of who is in charge of controls.
I dislike such situations where you do not know beforehand what your treatment will be like at the airport.
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Old 02-16-2020   #113
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Some have said a M2 with a 35 and TriX is all they need (and that is my favorite combo) but my FujiX100F comes damm close and is much more capable and does not cause worry when passing through an Xray machine.
The Fuji X100 may come damn close, but a 100% mechanical rangefinder film camera with a 35mm lens and fed with real black and white film which you can develop and archive in real folders so that you don't store digital files but actual analog photographic material at home, well it is not. Damn definitely.

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Photographers who mainly shoot film need to fight for their rights to carry film across the world.
I may be wrong but I don't remember cases of explosives prone to blow out the plane having been discovered hidden in film rolls, the same for weapons. That we now need to "fight for out rights" to carry film in our cabin luggage without them to be destroyed by the new CT machines is just to cry about with anger - our world is now turning mad 100%. What's next ? Teeth brushes not allowed on board ?

All of this should make us film photographers stop to travel by plane (which is, in most cases, quite possible if you decide to travel differently when you don't have to go to another continent for some mandatory reason).
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Old 02-16-2020   #114
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Here is a visual aid how the scanners look like so you can identify them:

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Old 02-16-2020   #115
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There's always the possibility to FedEx your film to your destination or purchase film there. And I recommend getting your film developed at your location so you don't have to fly back with exposed film.
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Old 02-16-2020   #116
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Stop whining and buy your own private jet. You can get a Boeing 737 Max jet real cheap these days. You can finance it by making quick stops in Colombia on your way home.
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Old 02-16-2020   #117
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I had a chat with an online agent for Schipol airport in Amsterdam. They can't guarantee hand check and is at the discretion of security staff. I suspect this will be the same Europe wide.

Quite sad, days of travelling with film are over.
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Old 02-16-2020   #118
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I had a chat with an online agent for Schipol airport in Amsterdam. They can't guarantee hand check and is at the discretion of security staff. I suspect this will be the same Europe wide.

Quite sad, days of travelling with film are over.
I am using film locally.
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Old 02-16-2020   #119
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Quite sad, days of traveling with film are over.
Oh please, don't exaggerate. In all likelihood, you will get a hand inspection at all airports that have these machine, then there's the option of buying film at your destination or FedEx/UPS it to your destination before you leave, and have it developed there.
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Old 02-16-2020   #120
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I've mailed/Fed-Exed film for years. Much simpler.
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