Old 01-26-2018   #481
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25 weeks....and counting (sent in my MM)
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Old 01-26-2018   #482
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I have an M240 on loan as long as they have my M9. I am getting used to having the M240.
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Old 01-26-2018   #483
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25 weeks...wow..
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Old 01-26-2018   #484
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Old 01-26-2018   #485
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It is no secret that the MM sensors are few and far between and his cameras will undoubtedly be among the last to be returned.

That's not the issue.

The real issue is that they only have one tech working but they don't want you to know that. Cuz it is a premium luxury outfit.
Leica NJ has less people working for them repairing cameras than my local independent repair shops.

That is why it takes months, but if you send it to Leica HQ in Solms you will get it back in a few weeks.
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Old 01-26-2018   #486
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I just made a mental note of the time since I sent my M9 to Leica NJ:

I think I counted correctly: Since early Aug 2017, it has been at least 5 months. Wow. I was prepared for 3 to 4 months, but 5-6 months and counting now....
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Old 01-27-2018   #487
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Decided to delete an unhelpful comment
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Old 01-27-2018   #488
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I'm done with Leica digital cameras. They haven't been able to measure-up.
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Old 01-27-2018   #489
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For others' information, my MM was received by Leica USA on May 19, 2017 and was [finally] returned back to me, sensor replaced, on January 15, 2018. Nice to get it back, but not using it for that long had me thinking about moving on. I have no idea how many MM replacement sensors they get, relative to M9/ME in a batch, but I suspect these batches are small.
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Old 01-27-2018   #490
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It's good to hear that the line is moving. I sent my Monochrom in mid June. So I've been waiting seven months. It took till early August just to get the confirmation that the sensor would be replaced. At that point I was told 20 weeks. If what was stated above is true I may be receiving it back soon. Or at least I hope so...
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Old 01-27-2018   #491
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That can't be right. The announcement was made in mid-May, which would mean that after eight months they are still working on the first month's receipts.
Not sure why this timetable can't be right, but perhaps it is specific to MMs.
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Old 01-27-2018   #492
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I have been waitin for my M9 since mid-August 2017. My Fuji has taken up the slack and may become the replacement.
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Old 01-27-2018   #493
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Unless I have missed something the M240 et seq have been reliable if that is any solace.
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Old 01-28-2018   #494
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Unless I have missed something the M240 et seq have been reliable if that is any solace.
You haven't missed anything. The M240 sensor assembly is fine.
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Old 02-24-2018   #495
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I received this morning an email from Leica NJ; my M9 will be back within a week and they want their M240 loaner back.

I have mixed feeling about it all. The modern M240 worked very well for me, but its weight and size seemed to be too much for me. The M9 sensor also seems to me as resulting in better looking color images. I have no options here but to forget about the M240 and to welcome back home my M9.
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Old 02-24-2018   #496
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This is good, your loved camera back with you!
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Old 02-24-2018   #497
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Thanks, Robert.
This also means that I must use my M9 to figure out how to best use the Hologon 16/8 for color images. The M240 has LiveView for easier checking, but it is not my camera.
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Old 03-31-2018   #498
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I received yesterday an email from Leica with an "invoice" for repairing the M9. The invoice is for $0, but maybe the receiving of the invoice signals the return of my M9 after having it sent to NJ for sensor inspection and replacement in September 2017. A former email from a manager at Leica on February 24 in which I was informed that my M9 had been repaired may have been sent to me too early. I feel good about getting back my M9 even though this also means that I send back the M240. I have to prepare myself for the M9 "challenges" again.
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Old 03-31-2018   #499
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I received yesterday an email from Leica with an "invoice" for repairing the M9. The invoice is for $0, but maybe the receiving of the invoice signals the return of my M9 after having it sent to NJ for sensor inspection and replacement in September 2017. A former email from a manager at Leica on February 24 in which I was informed that my M9 had been repaired may have been sent to me too early. I feel good about getting back my M9 even though this also means that I send back the M240. I have to prepare myself for the M9 "challenges" again.
Raid,

I got the invoice a day or two before my Monochrom, I'm in NYC so shipping from NJ is a day or two typically. So for you maybe a day or two longer for you in Florida.

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Old 03-31-2018   #500
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Thanks for the information, Joe. This is good to know. I could take the M240 on its last outing with me today!
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Old 03-31-2018   #501
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Raid, what do you feel are the "challenges" of the M9? And what will you have to give up after returning the M240?
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Old 03-31-2018   #502
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1. I need to be prepared that suddenly there is a need to "pause" after taking a few shots. The M9 decides to shut off or to play dead.

2. The battery will die much sooner than the larger battery of the M240.

3. No LiveView option for checking out shimming requirements for some lenses.

4. Smaller screen at back of M9.

Still, the M9 is a great (older) camera. The M240 seems to be solid as a rock. A powerhouse Leica that Leica users wished it were smaller in size. Then they got the M10.
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Old 03-31-2018   #503
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Raid,

I got the invoice a day or two before my Monochrom, I'm in NYC so shipping from NJ is a day or two typically. So for you maybe a day or two longer for you in Florida.

Joe
I received that same email invoice too about 3 weeks ago. I also received another email on the same day as my invoice that said my camera is going to a third party in Germany. That was 13 March, 2018.

I received another email from Leica just a few days ago that asked me to participate in a survey about Repair Service. I went to the survey...

... it was a SurveyMonkey survey that was not well designed. raid, I believe you do survey statistical analyses, I think you would agree.

I was kind and honest in my answers, but it was impossible to convey the information Leica needs regarding their repair service. The limited choices in all multiple-choice questions did not provide choices that actually reflect my experience and responses. As I've said quite a few times now, I am understanding of Leica's situation and would like to see them improve some simple things that would benefit everyone substantially. I don't see how the survey will help in any way.

raid, I am now very curious to see if your M9 comes home soon or if it rather made a detour to Germany first, hopefully to eventually return home, just not soon.

Around the time my M9 went in for its sensor, I purchased my M240 using a small unexpected inheritance that made the purchase less painful to the budget. Its a very nice camera; Along with my film Leicas, and other gear, I'm not "dead in the water" without my M9. I really have no place to complain about my ability to do photography, and I'm in a position to be patient with Leica. Still, I'm surprised at how things are unfolding. I hope others are also able to absorb the long-time absence.
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Old 03-31-2018   #504
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....
The M240 seems to be solid as a rock. A powerhouse Leica that Leica users wished it were smaller in size. Then they got the M10.
Yes this! Even though I may seem soured on Leica with my M9 experience, my M240 and film M experiences are great, and the M10 is a camera I think I will eventually own. Eventually.
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Old 03-31-2018   #505
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Well I thought my M240 was rock solid until it just locked up on me. It acted like it was off. Turning it off and back on again did nothing. Taking the battery out and putting it back in fixed it.
Still it's behaved much better than my M-E ever did.
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Old 03-31-2018   #506
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I received that same email invoice too about 3 weeks ago. I also received another email on the same day as my invoice that said my camera is going to a third party in Germany. That was 13 March, 2018.

I received another email from Leica just a few days ago that asked me to participate in a survey about Repair Service. I went to the survey...

... it was a SurveyMonkey survey that was not well designed. raid, I believe you do survey statistical analyses, I think you would agree.

I was kind and honest in my answers, but it was impossible to convey the information Leica needs regarding their repair service. The limited choices in all multiple-choice questions did not provide choices that actually reflect my experience and responses. As I've said quite a few times now, I am understanding of Leica's situation and would like to see them improve some simple things that would benefit everyone substantially. I don't see how the survey will help in any way.

raid, I am now very curious to see if your M9 comes home soon or if it rather made a detour to Germany first, hopefully to eventually return home, just not soon.

Around the time my M9 went in for its sensor, I purchased my M240 using a small unexpected inheritance that made the purchase less painful to the budget. Its a very nice camera; Along with my film Leicas, and other gear, I'm not "dead in the water" without my M9. I really have no place to complain about my ability to do photography, and I'm in a position to be patient with Leica. Still, I'm surprised at how things are unfolding. I hope others are also able to absorb the long-time absence.
Enjoy your M240. It is a fine camera.

Well, I did not return to Leica their M240 even though they emailed me a the UPS label. I suggested to send them back their M240 in the same box in which I will receive my M9 from them. They let me do this.

I should soon know if the M9 gets back to me soon or not.
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Old 03-31-2018   #507
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Well I thought my M240 was rock solid until it just locked up on me. It acted like it was off. Turning it off and back on again did nothing. Taking the battery out and putting it back in fixed it.
Still it's behaved much better than my M-E ever did.
It may be that batteries will have such issues once on a while in Leica cameras, or that cameras will have issues which require removal of the battery.
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Old 03-31-2018   #508
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What other of your treasured tools would you send away for seven month long repairs?
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Old 03-31-2018   #509
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It always is a problematic issue to send away "treasured tools".
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Old 03-31-2018   #510
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"Treasured tools" refers to the price of current M gear. For anyone relying on cameras (or any tool) for a living, a seven month wait just won't do. I'll be the first to admit that my feelings about Leica are shaped by the 62 year old model that I use every few days. Since a large part of the Leica rep is centered in reliability and dependability, it's hard to understand why seven month repairs are acceptable TO THEM..
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Old 03-31-2018   #511
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Re-shimming with M9 is easy. All it does is giving you instant negative.

Liveview successfully turns you to dead slow digital point-take-your-time-it-is-gone-anyway-shooter.
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Old 03-31-2018   #512
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I would not make it so dramatic
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Old 04-01-2018   #513
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1. I need to be prepared that suddenly there is a need to "pause" after taking a few shots. The M9 decides to shut off or to play dead.

2. The battery will die much sooner than the larger battery of the M240.

3. No LiveView option for checking out shimming requirements for some lenses.

4. Smaller screen at back of M9.
So points 1 and 2 make the M240 a better workhorse for high volume, or rapid shooting, then, while the M9 is OK for less intense, more casual or leisurely shooting. I haven't run up against these limitations with my M9, with my shooting style. If I had, I guess I would be scheming for a way to get an M240!

Point 3 would seem important for trying out non-M-mount lenses that have been adapted to M-mount. I can see how it would allow testing the lenses on-camera (your 15mm Hologon comes to mind).

Point 4: The screens on some of my other cameras, like my D700 and X100, do seem better for reviewing my shots. It may be the resolution, and not the size, that I find suboptimal, though. And the M9's histogram sometimes displays as a nearly flat line across the bottom of the graph. I never saw another camera do that, and have no idea what to make of it.

Overall, despite the nuisance of being without the M9 for 7 months, it seems to meet my needs for a digital Leica M. I didn't need it all winter in St. Louis, anyhow! In Florida, that's another story!

I'm sure your M9 will be back by Monday. When Stephanie at Schiller's told me she had received notice mine was on the way, I had it the next day!
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Old 04-01-2018   #514
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Re-shimming with M9 is easy. All it does is giving you instant negative.
I wish I knew what this wants to say.

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Liveview successfully turns you to dead slow digital point-take-your-time-it-is-gone-anyway-shooter.
Sure, but you probably wouldn't use live view for street shooting. That's what the viewfinder is for.
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Old 04-01-2018   #515
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Thanks, Rob. I am waiting to get back my M9. I will keep it and I will use it. When the M9 needs a rest for a couple of minutes, I use my M8. This has been my set-up.

Ko.Fe. meant to say that we could use the M9 for multiple images while keeping track of the shimming set for each image. Then we use the shimming that is shown to give the best focus.
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Old 04-01-2018   #516
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So points 1 and 2 make the M240 a better workhorse for high volume, or rapid shooting, then, while the M9 is OK for less intense, more casual or leisurely shooting. I haven't run up against these limitations with my M9, with my shooting style. If I had, I guess I would be scheming for a way to get an M240!

Point 3 would seem important for trying out non-M-mount lenses that have been adapted to M-mount. I can see how it would allow testing the lenses on-camera (your 15mm Hologon comes to mind).

Point 4: The screens on some of my other cameras, like my D700 and X100, do seem better for reviewing my shots. It may be the resolution, and not the size, that I find suboptimal, though. And the M9's histogram sometimes displays as a nearly flat line across the bottom of the graph. I never saw another camera do that, and have no idea what to make of it.

Overall, despite the nuisance of being without the M9 for 7 months, it seems to meet my needs for a digital Leica M. I didn't need it all winter in St. Louis, anyhow! In Florida, that's another story!

I'm sure your M9 will be back by Monday. When Stephanie at Schiller's told me she had received notice mine was on the way, I had it the next day!
There is one more point that I should have spelled out. Having a better battery in the M240 helps with photography in cold settings such as taking photos in the mountains during winter months. It has been reported that the M9 quickly dies (in a few minutes) when exposed to very cold weather. Must have back-up batteries in the pocket or keep the M9 always warm under the coat until taking a photo.
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Old 04-01-2018   #517
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I wish I knew what this wants to say.



Sure, but you probably wouldn't use live view for street shooting. That's what the viewfinder is for.
Put shim in. Take the picture of focus alligment target. Check the picture. It will tell you right away if more or less or spot on.
Just like with film camera, but picture is instant.
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Old 04-01-2018   #518
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There is one more point that I should have spelled out. Having a better battery in the M240 helps with photography in cold settings such as taking photos in the mountains during winter months. It has been reported that the M9 quickly dies (in a few minutes) when exposed to very cold weather. Must have back-up batteries in the pocket or keep the M9 always warm under the coat until taking a photo.
Any battery will quit fast in freezing temperatures and with camera under cold wind.
Battery grip makes it longer.

This winter someone at LUF took M9 for several days upto mountains. To my surprise no issues were reported.
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Old 04-01-2018   #519
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Is there an external battery holder for the M9 or a battery grip? I don't think so. If you find a way to hold your m9 under your winter coat most of the time, it may work out well in cold weather.
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Old 04-01-2018   #520
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Put shim in. Take the picture of focus alligment target. Check the picture. It will tell you right away if more or less or spot on.
Just like with film camera, but picture is instant.

With Live View, no shimming needed, no wasting time with focus alignment tools, no trial and error trying to get the lens to focus correctly. While you are spending time doing that, missing all those 'it is gone anyway live view shots', live view shooter is outside making those shots.
It also shows actual 100% accurate image coverage, actual real time exposure, and can use any lens with an adapter. Any lens, not just one with RF cam. Try to focus a Minolta 58 1.2 or Petzval Art lens on an M9. You cannot because it does not have live view.
Live View in an M camera is fantastic as it allows you to use any M mount lens with the optical RF, and any other lens with Live View. You get two cameras in one. No other mfg offers that because while they may make LiveView cameras, none also make one with a real RF viewfinder.

I had the M-E. Functionally the M240 and later are far superior. The really really nice thing about the M9 series is the CCD sensor. But Leica's support etc with that has made it a dead end. Once the next batch of sensors fail, you're done.
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