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Cannot upload a LR generated file to an Apple device
Old 01-29-2020   #1
robert blu
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Cannot upload a LR generated file to an Apple device

LR user since the first version.

My problem is: I export from LRCC files to a SD cart and with a card reader (SD to Lightning) I would like to unpload them to an Apple device, Iphone or Ipad. But the devices (tried different devices) do not see the exported files. If on the same SD card is a file generated by a photocamera (jpg or DNG) these are seen by the devices.

It happens with any format I export and try to upload (jpg, tiff, dng). Even my very old Mac Book with a slot for SD cards does not see/read them.

If I connect a USB card reader to my Mac Pro I can see the files on the card (open and work with them).

I do not understand how a file generated by LR CC cannot be uploaded to an Apple Device when in the same conditions file generated by cameras (I tried Leica and Nikon, DNG, NEF and jpg) can be read without problems.

I tried different cards, brands and or sizes.

Any suggetsions or help would be much appreciated, thanks

robert
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Old 01-29-2020   #2
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When you say the devices “can't see” the files, what app on the device do you mean? Do you mean that you can't import them into the Photos app, or that the Files app doesn’t list them as being on the card, or something else?

I usually move LR exports to my iPad via Airdrop, but can try a card import when I get home from work... just want to make sure I have enough info to replicate what you're trying to do.
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Old 01-29-2020   #3
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To clarify, you are exporting the files from Lightroom Mobile to an SD card and then having trouble reading them on other Apple devices, including the MacBook, but are having no issue with the MacPro?
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Old 01-29-2020   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ranger9 View Post
When you say the devices “can't see” the files, what app on the device do you mean? Do you mean that you can't import them into the Photos app, or that the Files app doesn’t list them as being on the card, or something else?

I usually move LR exports to my iPad via Airdrop, but can try a card import when I get home from work... just want to make sure I have enough info to replicate what you're trying to do.
The device let say i.phone see there is a card reader and open the photos app but photos than does not see any file, a message similar to "there is nothing to import"

But if there is in the same location on the same card a file generates by a camera (JPG or DNG) it sees thios one, only this one.

I didn't try airdrop, thanks for suggestion, maybe the way to do it.
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Old 01-29-2020   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Henry View Post
To clarify, you are exporting the files from Lightroom Mobile to an SD card and then having trouble reading them on other Apple devices, including the MacBook, but are having no issue with the MacPro?
exactly, I export form LRCC to an sd card and the diles are not seen by the Apple device but if I reinsert this card on the Mac Pro via a USB card reader the files are there.
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Old 01-29-2020   #6
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In iOS and iPadOS 13 (latest) you might try opening the Files app to see if you can see the images there. It lets you view the contents of the card directly without using the Photos app.

If you are using Lightroom CC, why are you copying files around though? It should let you open them from the cloud anywhere.
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Old 01-29-2020   #7
Richard G
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AirDrop too can be fickle to power up but it is a good way to do this when it’s working. Email would also work. The clear need of the card reader is in the field with recent camera files. Apple might be tellling you there is a better way to do your task.
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Old 01-29-2020   #8
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Thanks you all for your help. Maybe I wasn't clear or was my mistake, but I'm on LR Classic not connected to the cloud.

The reason is to transfer some old files into my iphone and my wife's ipad (but it doesn't work also with new files).

Following your suggestions I made a quick test with airdrop and it works.Crossing fingers. I only tested 3 files, not sure how I can transfer 7/800 files. It's late now here, I'll make more test tomorrow.

Airdrop can be a solution but still do not understand why a jpg file from LR doesn't work when a jp DNG) file straight out of the camera works ! Files placed in the DCIM folder, cards formatted and reformatted...

As if there is a kind of conflict between Adobe and Apple...
Thanks again, I'll report tomorrow.
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Old 01-29-2020   #9
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I tested this exact scenario and I couldn't get it to work either. The single file that I had on the card from the camera was visible in the Photos app import, but none of the other images anywhere on the card. I verified that I could see the images in the Files app on the iPad without any issue at all, it's something in the Photos app that breaks. I tried with images generated from all sorts of things, not just Adobe, and had the same problem.

I have a sort-of-annoying workaround to get the images into the Photos app if you want. That said, Airdrop is fast on modern apple hardware so that's a good option too.

As to why it happens, I have no idea!

If you want my sort-of-annoying work around I'll write it up for you. It requires you to take a few steps on the device you want to import to, and it's not difficult, just annoying.
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Old 01-29-2020   #10
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A recent iOS update broke the feature on iPhone for importing photos via a USB device adapted to lightning. I understand this feature "may" still work with iPad.
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Old 01-29-2020   #11
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Okay, I'm home and I tried it. Here are my results.

— I took an SD card, freshly formatted on my Olympus Pen F, and put it into my iMac 5K running Catalina. As expected, the card showed up as a volume named NO NAME.

— I launched Lightroom Classic, selected a few files from the Library window, and exported them as JPEG to the top level of the NO NAME volume (i.e. I didn't put them into a folder.) I then ejected the card.

— I connected an Apple Lightning SD card reader to my iPad and put the card into it.

— I opened the Files app and navigated to the NO NAME volume. The photo files were listed. I was able to click on each one and was able to view it and save it to Photos.

— After I had saved the photos, they showed up normally in the Photos app.

— I was NOT able to get the photos to auto-import through the Photos app, the way you usually can with files saved to an SD card from a camera. I couldn't see any obvious reason this wouldn't work, but it didn’t. I tried making a DCIM folder (the way a camera does) and putting the files in that; this would cause the Photos app to launch and trigger the Import panel, but it didn't see my files to import them.

— I wasn't able to test this on my iPhone because it's an older model (5S) and doesn't have the Files app.

POSSIBLE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MY EXPERIENCE AND YOURS:

— I was using the skookum Apple SD reader that connects directly to a Lightning port. A USB adapter connected to a generic SD reader might be different.

— I was using an iPad. An iPhone might be different (per JoeV's note above.)

— I used the Files app to import the images from the card. The Photos app wouldn't do it.
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Old 01-29-2020   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ranger9 View Post
Okay, I'm home and I tried it. Here are my results.

— I took an SD card, freshly formatted on my Olympus Pen F, and put it into my iMac 5K running Catalina. As expected, the card showed up as a volume named NO NAME.

— I launched Lightroom Classic, selected a few files from the Library window, and exported them as JPEG to the top level of the NO NAME volume (i.e. I didn't put them into a folder.) I then ejected the card.

— I connected an Apple Lightning SD card reader to my iPad and put the card into it.

— I opened the Files app and navigated to the NO NAME volume. The photo files were listed. I was able to click on each one and was able to view it and save it to Photos.

— After I had saved the photos, they showed up normally in the Photos app.

— I was NOT able to get the photos to auto-import through the Photos app, the way you usually can with files saved to an SD card from a camera. I couldn't see any obvious reason this wouldn't work, but it didn’t. I tried making a DCIM folder (the way a camera does) and putting the files in that; this would cause the Photos app to launch and trigger the Import panel, but it didn't see my files to import them.

— I wasn't able to test this on my iPhone because it's an older model (5S) and doesn't have the Files app.

POSSIBLE DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MY EXPERIENCE AND YOURS:

— I was using the skookum Apple SD reader that connects directly to a Lightning port. A USB adapter connected to a generic SD reader might be different.

— I was using an iPad. An iPhone might be different (per JoeV's note above.)

— I used the Files app to import the images from the card. The Photos app wouldn't do it.
Same experience. I ran through it a couple times with different configurations and had the same result. I think a shortcut to import them into photos from files is the only solution I can think of. Fortunately shortcuts are easy to make!
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Old 01-30-2020   #13
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Thanks again ranger9, Henry and JoeV for your answer.

First it is nice to know that it's a general problem and I'm not the only one here!

My conclusion is that it is not possible to upload a LR generated files to an old Apple device. I found this because I wanted to upload a few jpg files from LR Classic to my wife's old i.pad (IOS 10.3.3) and because I was not able to do it I tried on my i.phone which is old as well (5S IOS 12.4.5) thinking that maybe something was wrong in the iPad than I discovered it doesn't work on the iphone as well, my wife iPhone is the same model.

Thanks to you I discovered there is a work around via airdrop.

Still I do not understand (this is curiosity!) why with same procedure I can easily see and import the camera generated file jpg, new or dng but not the LR generated files placed on the same card in the same folders!

Out of curiosity later in the day I'll try to transfer a iPhone jog file to the computer without importing it in LR , erase it from the SD card (formatting), replace it on the SD card in the DCIM folder and see if the device will see it!

Thanks again.
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Old 01-30-2020   #14
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robert:

Formatted an SD card with SD Card Formatter so as to be sure it was clean and fresh, and mounted that card with a card reader on my Mac mini.

Using Lightroom Classic, I selected three photos at random, all DNG files from whatever non-iDevice.

Choose File>Export in LR Classic, set the parameters for a JPEG export to 2000 pixels on the long edge, and set the destination to a new DCIM folder on the SD card (named TRANSFER during formatting).

Once complete, I unmounted the TRANSFER on the mini and fitted it into a Apple Lightning to SD Card adapter. I connected the adapter to my iPhone 8 Plus running the latest iOS.

Using the Files app, I used the Browse feature to navigate to TRANSFER > DCIM. My three JPEGs appeared. I tapped Select and Select All, then tapped the Share symbol. Scrolling the view that appears, I tapped the Save symbol.

I exited the Files app and opened Photos. My three JPEGs appeared as the last three photos in the Photos library.

I repeated the test using an Apple USB-C to SD Card adapter and my iPad Pro 11". Same procedure moved the three files to Photos on the iPad.

Give it a shot ... You probably just didn't realize that you use the Share command and scroll to get the Save function, and that the Save function puts them into the Photos sandboxed file system on the iDevice...

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Old 01-30-2020   #15
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It sounds like the larger problem is with files written to an SD card by something other than a camera. The Files app can see and import these files, but the Photos app can't... so older iOS versions that don't include the Files app are out of luck.

It's been a long time since I researched the file structure of SD cards, but I'm going to infer that there's some kind of invisible directory or map that keeps track of what media have been written to the card. A camera, music player, or other device designed to save onto Sd cards also updates this directory/map whenever you add a new photo, music file, etc. However, if you just mount the card as a volume on your Mac and copy files to it from the Finder, Lightroom export, etc., then the directory/map does NOT get updated with your new content.

Presumably Photos depends on this directory/map to know what it can import (and also keep track of what files already have been imported) so it can't see files that have been added without updating the map. Files does NOT depend on the map and can read files directly off the volume structure, so it has no trouble recognizing and importing files no matter how they got placed on the card.

I figure this post will display just enough ignorance that somebody who actually knows will weigh in with a description of exactly how the SD file structure works, but in the meantime that's my best guess. The good news should be that if your iOS device does include the Files app, you'll be able to import files from SD card no matter what kind of device placed them on the card.
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Old 01-30-2020   #16
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Older iOS cannot work with external file systems at all (natively) except in very specific circumstances (auto-import of image files from an SD card into Photos as long as everything else is in perfect order is one of them). But everything has to be just right for that to work.

It's only with iOS and iPadOS 13 that generalized file system access to external file systems through the Files app (or through programmatic use by apps of the operating system underlying calls) is guaranteed. If your iDevice cannot be updated to iOS/iPadOS 13, well, it's just not going to work with any native system apps or facilities ... Third party implementations of file system access are the only hope and that's a fragile game.

There's nothing about the file system on an SD card that affects this. You can format an SD card with a variety of file systems (including Apple's own file system); FAT, FAT32, xFAT, and Apple's file system implementations all work fine as long as you're working with host systems/devices that know them. The Files app has been around since before iOS/iPadOS 13, but prior to the incorporation of external file system access into 13, it was only able to access files stored by apps in their sandboxed file directory format.

The pre-13 capability of Photos to read files from external systems ... including cameras ... are based on the Digital Camera IMage [DCIM] file storage directory structure, a standard which can be implemented in *any* file system.

The ongoing issue with access to external file systems and iOS/iPadOS 13 implementation is that files can only be read by apps that understand their format ... there are few (or no) apps that can read and display data from any "generic" file, and that once a file is stored locally, it is typically stored in an app's sandboxed file directories. This promotes good security at the expense of some convenience.

The biggest issues I've found with 13 and file system access is that the UI has been subtly altered from 12 and earlier versions of iOS. The access control point is now embedded in a different way into the Share panel choices, and many folks have expressed some consternation that their often used commands are no longer available because they aren't presented the same way as they were before. This is a learning issue as much as a design issue ... a nice bit of succinct documentation would help many people be comfortable immediately, if only they would read it. Many simply refuse to, saying "If it's not intuitive, why should I bother?" Weil, I don't know what intuitive really means in that statement but I'm the kind of person who reads all the documentation for every device and app I ever use... LOL!

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Old 01-30-2020   #17
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From what I can tell, in this thread and my own fiddling around, if you cannot update the devices to the latest iOS, airdrop is the sanest option. Fortunately it works pretty well.

I'm very surprised that this doesn't work, there was a workaround for not being able to get external videos onto the iPad that involved the lightning camera-kit adapter and a DCIM folder to trick photos into importing and playing videos from a card or hard drive. Maybe they were trying to disable that, or maybe they just missed it during regression.

If you have the inclination you could report it as a bug to Apple at https://www.apple.com/feedback/.
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Old 01-30-2020   #18
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Thanks you all. Using the files app it works and it works with airdrop.

I discovered this by chance because I wanted to use an old ipad (wife's) just to display photos. And I tried it on my iphone 5s which I'm in the process to change by the way.

Let's say the problem is solved for what concerns the new devices (for sure at Apple thgey will be very happy when we buy a new ipad or iphone ) and I will not use the old ipad to as a photo display.

What I find strange is what I wrote in my previopus post, why a LR file cannot be uploaded when a file (both in the same card, location etc) generated by the camera can be uploaded ! A jpg, tiff, dng or nef should be jpg. tiff, dng or nef in any case ! It seems evident there is a difference which makes them not uploadeable on an apple device! Ok. no rant here, now it is just a question of curiosity !

Thanks everyone!
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Old 01-30-2020   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robert blu View Post
Thanks you all. Using the files app it works and it works with airdrop.

I discovered this by chance because I wanted to use an old ipad (wife's) just to display photos. And I tried it on my iphone 5s which I'm in the process to change by the way.

Let's say the problem is solved for what concerns the new devices (for sure at Apple thgey will be very happy when we buy a new ipad or iphone ) and I will not use the old ipad to as a photo display.

What I find strange is what I wrote in my previopus post, why a LR file cannot be uploaded when a file (both in the same card, location etc) generated by the camera can be uploaded ! A jpg, tiff, dng or nef should be jpg. tiff, dng or nef in any case ! It seems evident there is a difference which makes them not uploadeable on an apple device! Ok. no rant here, now it is just a question of curiosity !

Thanks everyone!
(bolded) Hmm. Well, I don't understand either.

My iPhone and iPad have somewhere around 12,000 photos installed on them which were created by exporting JPEG files from Lightroom (in use since it first appeared in public beta 2006) and transferred using iPhoto, AirDrop, Files, and a half dozen other mechanisms. There's never been any problem getting them onto the iPhone or iPad in every iOS version that has ever existed.

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