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Old 01-27-2019   #41
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Jon, curious what your thoughts are regarding the build quality and ergonomics of the Ultron.
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Old 01-27-2019   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by splitimageview View Post
Jon, curious what your thoughts are regarding the build quality and ergonomics of the Ultron.
Build quality is top notch - definitely a vast improvement over the LTM and initial M-mount lenses. Overall, the lens feels very solid and focus feels precise and smooth with no play at all.

As for ergonomics, the lens is a lightweight but has just enough heft to it to balance nicely on my MP on a neck strap, unlike a Color Skopar 35/2.5 which is so light the lens always tilts upward. The aperture ring is like the Nokton 35 & 40 f1.4 - easy enough to use. The stick is fine for me, but focusing is also possible by gripping the chrome knurling just forward of the stick. The ergonomics work for me.

My gear lust for a V2 or V3 Summicron 35mm has now evaporated, so my wallet is happy about that. Actually, I'm now eyeing off my Summicron ASPH while calculating what I could do with the cash if I sold it lol.

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Old 01-27-2019   #43
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Originally Posted by jsrockit View Post
So you want them to be autofocus? 😂
sure, but i don't think that'll do much good on any M camera.

jokes aside, it's a very nice lens and i'm happy voigtlander is producing it, even if it isn't for me.
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Old 01-27-2019   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonmanjiro View Post
Build quality is top notch - definitely a vast improvement over the LTM and initial M-mount lenses. Overall, the lens feels very solid and focus feels precise and smooth with no play at all.

As for ergonomics, the lens is a lightweight but has just enough heft to it to balance nicely on my MP on a neck strap, unlike a Color Skopar 35/2.5 which is so light the lens always tilts upward. The aperture ring is like the Nokton 35 & 40 f1.4 - easy enough to use. The stick is fine for me, but focusing is also possible by gripping the chrome knurling just forward of the stick. The ergonomics work for me.

My gear lust for a V2 or V3 Summicron 35mm has now evaporated, so my wallet is happy about that. Actually, I'm now eyeing off my Summicron ASPH while calculating what I could do with the cash if I sold it lol.
Thanks for your initial impressions and photos of this lens. If I were in the market for a 35mm lens for Leica M, I would strongly consider this lens. The ergonomics don't look that different from the 28/3.5 Color Skopar, a much loved and used lens. Is that about right?

Incidentally, your Instagram feed of your life in Japan is inspiring me about an upcoming trip I will be making this summer. Cheers!
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Old 01-27-2019   #45
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Jon, is the stick removable?


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Old 01-27-2019   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nzeeman View Post
sorry i didn't write correctly what i wanted to say- i thought new f1.7 is surely better than old f1.7...
O.k., that's correct!
I had the Ultron 35 f1.7 LTM too, and loved it a lot; but the new one is better, for sure.
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Old 01-27-2019   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jja View Post
The ergonomics don't look that different from the 28/3.5 Color Skopar, a much loved and used lens. Is that about right?
Yep, pretty much the same as a Skopar 28/3.5.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jja View Post
Incidentally, your Instagram feed of your life in Japan is inspiring me about an upcoming trip I will be making this summer. Cheers!
Thanks! Glad to hear you found some inspiration there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik van Straten View Post
Jon, is the stick removable?
Erik, my guess is that the stick is just a screw in piece, but I do not intend to experiment to see if it does screw out. Besides, what would you do with the hole that would remain after its screwed out? Would look pretty ugly imo.
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Old 01-27-2019   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonmanjiro View Post
Erik, my guess is that the stick is just a screw in piece, but I do not intend to experiment to see if it does screw out. Besides, what would you do with the hole that would remain after its screwed out? Would look pretty ugly imo.
Jon, thank you, this is perfectly all right.

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Old 01-27-2019   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonmanjiro View Post
Build quality is top notch - definitely a vast improvement over the LTM and initial M-mount lenses. Overall, the lens feels very solid and focus feels precise and smooth with no play at all.

As for ergonomics, the lens is a lightweight but has just enough heft to it to balance nicely on my MP on a neck strap, unlike a Color Skopar 35/2.5 which is so light the lens always tilts upward. The aperture ring is like the Nokton 35 & 40 f1.4 - easy enough to use. The stick is fine for me, but focusing is also possible by gripping the chrome knurling just forward of the stick. The ergonomics work for me.

My gear lust for a V2 or V3 Summicron 35mm has now evaporated, so my wallet is happy about that. Actually, I'm now eyeing off my Summicron ASPH while calculating what I could do with the cash if I sold it lol.


Everything about this lens looks great. After using a CV lens with the stick, I found that stick or tab are fine for me. Thanks for the ongoing impressions and comments Jon!
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Old 01-27-2019   #50
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Looks fantastic - Don't know if I'd get rid of the asph cron just yet but it looks about equal to it. I'm curious to see the real world wide open samples start to roll out.
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Old 01-31-2019   #51
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Anyone happen to have this comparison done via digital sensor?
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Old 01-31-2019   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik van Straten View Post
It would be also interesting to compare the Ultron 35mm f/2 with the recent Ultron 35mm f/1.7. The f/2 is much smaller, but the f/1.7 is hard to beat optically.

Erik.
I own the 35mm f1.7 Ultron, 35mm f2 Summicron ASPH and the Ultron is a superior lens on my digital M262 compared to the Leica. Sharper and way more flare resistant. The Summicron ASPH flares horribly while the 35mm f1.7 can be shot into the light all day long without fear.

The one desirable factor with the 35 Summicron ASPH compared to the 35mm f1.7 Ultron is, you can remove the hood and shoot with zero frame interference.

I know many do not like the ergomonics of the 35mm f1.7 Ultron VM. I get along fine with it and love the classic look with the Voigtlander vented hood fitted.

If this new 35mm f2 Ulton is the same optical and flare resistance quality of the 35mm f1.7 VM, it should be a smashing success.
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Old 02-08-2019   #53
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Great thread thank you. What about chromatic aberration? Just curious knowing by experience that the new CV 21/3.5 is not free from it.
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Old 02-08-2019   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Huss View Post
I don't understand why Leica gets a pass on this. People bag on the 7Artisans 35mm f2 for being flarey, but it is more resistant than my Summicron!....
As much as i like it otherwise, my 7artisans 35/2 is one of my most flare prone lenses when strong light sources are outside the frame, even with a hood on the lens (here a B+W rubber hood):
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-...-kpw2QCG-L.jpg
Suffice it to add some shade to the hood, here with my left hand, to remove flare almost completely though:
https://photos.smugmug.com/photos/i-...-zTXVHVw-L.jpg
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Old 02-12-2019   #55
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This may already have been asked, but how do you compare the CV 35/1.7 with the CV 35/2? They cost about the same.
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Old 02-12-2019   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raid View Post
This may already have been asked, but how do you compare the CV 35/1.7 with the CV 35/2? They cost about the same.
I would imagine the bigger difference is in the ergonomics than the optics. The 35/1.7 seems to be an "acquired taste" with the unique, old school-type knurled focus ring.

I like it, but I know many who do not.
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Old 02-13-2019   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by raid View Post
This may already have been asked, but how do you compare the CV 35/1.7 with the CV 35/2? They cost about the same.
A topic for another thread. Who is up to the task?! Alas, not me as I do not own an Ultron 35mm f1.7.

My guess is that the main differences would come down to size, handling and design, with not that much difference in performance. The tiny size of the slightly slower Ultron wins for me.
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Old 02-13-2019   #58
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Usually ergonomics and looks are way more important than small optical differences between lenses.

Erik.
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Old 02-13-2019   #59
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Is there a chance that the 35/1.7 is better optically?
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Old 02-15-2019   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jonmanjiro View Post
...
My guess is that the main differences would come down to size, handling and design, with not that much difference in performance. The tiny size of the slightly slower Ultron wins for me.
The new Ultron f2 (8 elements, 6 groups) has a different lens design than the f1.7 (9 elements, 7 groups)
https://www.voigtlaender.de/lenses/v...rical/?lang=en
https://www.voigtlaender.de/lenses/v...rical/?lang=en
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Old 02-15-2019   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EVIL_Guy View Post
The new Ultron f2 (8 elements, 6 groups) has a different lens design than the f1.7 (9 elements, 7 groups)
https://www.voigtlaender.de/lenses/v...rical/?lang=en
https://www.voigtlaender.de/lenses/v...rical/?lang=en
The two lens diagrams look somewhat similar in concept though, at least with the first 6 elements, don't they...
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Old 02-15-2019   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik van Straten View Post
Try the Summilux 35mm f/1.4 steel rim, version 206XXXX. Loveliest of all.

Erik.
Have you any personal experience with comparing the summilux and nokton classic 35mm f1.4?

Hard to justify spending more on a lens than I did my car
the nokton images I've seen are truly fantastic when one uses its "faults" to their advantage.
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Old 02-17-2019   #63
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Thanks for the test, Jon. Looks like the most pronounced difference between the two lenses is in the amount of vignetting. The older Summicron 35 versions (preasph. and earlier) also exhibited heavier vignetting. The cost of miniaturization, it seems. The Summicron 35 Asph is not completely vignette-free either (Putts reports -1.8 stops in the corners) but it does have a more even performance than other 35s. It does flare a bit, that's true. Few Leica lenses are flare-proof. On the other hand it does very, very well with colour. Which reminds me -- any shots from the Ultron 35/2 on colour film?

PS. The UK importer of Zeiss/ Voigtlander I usually buy from, sold the first 10 Ultron 35/2 like hotcakes. Whoosh.
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Old 02-17-2019   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by d.dulin View Post
Have you any personal experience with comparing the summilux and nokton classic 35mm f1.4?
I have a lot of experience with the Summilux steel rim. I own one since 2001. I don't have a car. I've seen enough examples of pictures with the Nokton 35mm f/1.4. I never liked these because of the barrel distortion.

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Old 02-17-2019   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Erik van Straten View Post
I have a lot of experience with the Summilux steel rim. I own one since 2001. I don't have a car. I've seen enough examples of pictures with the Nokton 35mm f/1.4. I never liked these because of the barrel distortion.

Erik.
i see distortion on every summilux photo as well... but i guess price is straightening lines....
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Old 02-17-2019   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nzeeman View Post
i see distortion on every summilux photo
Not on mine.

Leica M3, Summilux 35mm f/1.4 steel rim, Tmax400.

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Old 02-17-2019   #67
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well it changes with distance-this photo suffers from wavy one for example.. on closer focus is just barrel...

but lets stop this and just comment about the great job Voigtlander did with this lens and how ultron dominated this duel...
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Old 02-17-2019   #68
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but lets stop this and just comment about the great job Voigtlander did with this lens and how ultron dominated this duel...
dominated? let's stop THIS nonsense.
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Old 02-17-2019   #69
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I believe in letting images do the talking. As long as I am satisfied with my own images taken with my own lenses, I never feel the need to justify or defend any lenses to anyone. A lens is just a tool. I would not make it a personal fight to defend one lens over another.
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Old 02-17-2019   #70
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Quote:
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Thanks for the test, Jon. Looks like the most pronounced difference between the two lenses is in the amount of vignetting. The older Summicron 35 versions (preasph. and earlier) also exhibited heavier vignetting. The cost of miniaturization, it seems. The Summicron 35 Asph is not completely vignette-free either (Putts reports -1.8 stops in the corners) but it does have a more even performance than other 35s. It does flare a bit, that's true. Few Leica lenses are flare-proof. On the other hand it does very, very well with colour. Which reminds me -- any shots from the Ultron 35/2 on colour film?

PS. The UK importer of Zeiss/ Voigtlander I usually buy from, sold the first 10 Ultron 35/2 like hotcakes. Whoosh.
I have a roll of Natura 1600 waiting to be scanned, Alkis. Meant to do it over the weekend but got sidetracked with other stuff. Will post some pics from that roll soon!
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Old 02-17-2019   #71
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Quote:
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I believe in letting images do the talking. As long as I am satisfied with my own images taken with my own lenses, I never feel the need to justify or defend any lenses to anyone. A lens is just a tool. I would not make it a personal fight to defend one lens over another.
Yes Raid, but I can't stand iniquity. Sometimes people just say nonsense when they try to make a popular statement.

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Old 02-17-2019   #72
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I understand what you are saying, Erik. If we stick to making comparisons based on personal experiences, it should be useful information to all here.
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Old 02-17-2019   #73
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I'd be interested to see how the new CV Ultron 35/2 compares to the M-Rokkor 40/2 and Summicron-C 40/2. Not a huge difference in focal length, and the 40mm lenses are also very compact, like the Ultron. Anyone?
Edit: something to discuss in another thread...

Correction: I meant to say 40mm lenses, not 35.. now corrected
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Old 02-17-2019   #74
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Wink

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Yes Raid, but I can't stand iniquity. Sometimes people just say nonsense when they try to make a popular statement.

Erik.
yes yes of course - its ok that you say bad things about nokton but when i say that summilux have wobbly distortion which is obvious- then i become person who just wanna draw attention... i love you leica people! (now it will come that aryument-you hate it because you cant afford it-but leica simply doesnt have that mystical power for me... i had m4 and my wife has m6 and still i sold mine and use canon p which is same in everything with better film loading... and not to mention that almost all leica lenses have distortions which i absolutely hate... i simply like zeiss approach more since they try to keep their lines flat and dont hunt for unnecessary speed. so its not me hating leica-but me hating the fact that leica owners never admit any fault of leica lens or body, and never accept that some other manufacturers lens can be better. i even saw reviews that see leica magic in leica p&s cameras that were just minoltas)
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Old 02-18-2019   #75
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I love you leica people!
Not sure you picked the right person to get stuck in to for being a Leica fanboy, considering Erik has been a vocal advocate of several Voigtlander lenses for years. But you know, whatever...
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Old 02-18-2019   #76
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Question

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Not sure you picked the right person to get stuck in to for being a Leica fanboy, considering Erik has been a vocal advocate of several Voigtlander lenses for years. But you know, whatever...
well maybe je was but in reality ultron wipes the floor with summicron in everything except vignetting...
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Old 02-18-2019   #77
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guys, let's not derail the thread any further ok.
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Old 02-18-2019   #78
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Jon,

Despite the usual snarkiness that crops up now and again, my hat is off to you for the lens testing you have done. As always, great job!

Eric, thank you for your input as well. As always, it is a pleasure hearing from you and seeing your images.

As for me, there are still two Leica cameras in my bags at the moment but neither is an M. Maybe one day, that Black Paint MP or an M10 will find a way to my door... but I am so busy with the important things in life right now and my work has evolved as well with Medium and Full Frame Formats. When/if I do return to an M, your testing has given me a good idea about which lens to choose. I am sure it will be "my" dream lens though, the 35mm Summilux, the "Bokeh King". Strictly a personal choice though I have always loved the Summilux.

The V lens is a great choice too! If I could afford both, then I would buy them.
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Old 02-18-2019   #79
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Hey, Jon - Very helpful post and images. I think I told you that I love the C/V 35 1.2. I have a v.1 of that lens that works well with all my Leicas. I love the OOF areas on that lens. I'd love to hear your appraisal of the f:2 lens's OFF areas where the subject is close to the close-focus distance. In other words, subject in the foreground, busy background.

I used to be a 50mm guy -- not exclusively, but as a jumping off point. I have to say, though, as I have gotten older and my photographic vision has . . .ahhh. . . matured, that my view of the world has widened. Can't really explain why, but the 35 is my starting point now.

The technical "winners" vs. "losers" debate doesn't really get my blood going. Sean Reid has sort of fed this idea: that different lenses have different qualities and that you dip into the bag to get the qualities you want.

Anyway, what I am interested in is whether the new (and exciting) f:2 offering is more like the 1.2 in rendering at f:2 or whether it is busier in the background. Happy to take an answer off-line if you think your impression is going to stoke the passions unhelpfully. . ..

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Old 02-18-2019   #80
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found this on flickr-seems pretty nice oof
https://flic.kr/p/2d72Npk
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