David Hughes
David Hughes
Hi,
I keep reading threads here and there along the lines of "I have just bough a Leica xxx and wonder what FSU lens to go with it as I am broke/married/etc".
I often wonder why they don't buy a FED 2 (cheap) body and a 50's Summitar which would seem to give the best of both worlds: I just hope I don't have to spell it all out.
In a nutshell; the FED 2 is a nice development of the range with a lot of sensible features. Thus; the back comes off for loading, modern shutter speeds 30th to 500th (adequate for most newbies), decent view-finder with colour contrast for RF patch, flash sync, self-timer, strap lugs and eyepiece adjustment for the VF. The Summitar; well, what can I say? It's the bargain Leica f/2 lens in my opinion and coated nicely.
Experience tells me that repairing a 39mm Leica or early M series will cost far more than that entire outfit but no one seems to think my way, or do they?
Regards, David
I keep reading threads here and there along the lines of "I have just bough a Leica xxx and wonder what FSU lens to go with it as I am broke/married/etc".
I often wonder why they don't buy a FED 2 (cheap) body and a 50's Summitar which would seem to give the best of both worlds: I just hope I don't have to spell it all out.
In a nutshell; the FED 2 is a nice development of the range with a lot of sensible features. Thus; the back comes off for loading, modern shutter speeds 30th to 500th (adequate for most newbies), decent view-finder with colour contrast for RF patch, flash sync, self-timer, strap lugs and eyepiece adjustment for the VF. The Summitar; well, what can I say? It's the bargain Leica f/2 lens in my opinion and coated nicely.
Experience tells me that repairing a 39mm Leica or early M series will cost far more than that entire outfit but no one seems to think my way, or do they?
Regards, David
Well, I'm a body first lens second type. I've used Leica Ms without Leica lenses before (CV, not FSU). I find that most lenses are good enough... but there is only one rangefinder that does it for me... Leica.
I have had problems with Leica lenses on FSU bodies. The FSU lenses use a thick RF cam that connects better with the finger-style RF pickup of the body. The Summarit, Summitar, and many other German/Japanese lenses that I have use a thinner RF cam and the RF pickup of the FSU body slides underneath it and will not couple correctly.
The Nikkor 5cm f2 has a thick cam and works nicely on my Zorki 3M.
The Nikkor 5cm f2 has a thick cam and works nicely on my Zorki 3M.
Keith
The best camera is one that still works!
I have to lodge my support for the humble Fed 2 here!
It's a helluva camera IMO and was my first venture into FSU ownership courtesy of Oleg.
It's a helluva camera IMO and was my first venture into FSU ownership courtesy of Oleg.
gavinlg
Mentor
I'm not well versed into FEDs but my zorki broke on the 2nd or third wind? As such I'm not so interested in russian engineering...
oftheherd
Mentor
Back in the ancient history of RFF, that was a much discussed topic. Now FSU get short shrift.
dave lackey
Mentor
Yeah, I know what you mean. But that darned Leica body is so alluring!
Even when it's the lens, the bodies are so tempting and scrimping on a lens is the unfortunate next step sometimes.
Neare
Well-known
Mate, for these people it's about owning a 'leica' not what the photos look like.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
I would contend that Zorki 6 is a better body for daily user.
It has a better rangefinder (more contrast) than fed 2, the back opens up for even faster loading, and it has an advance film lever instead of a dial.
If Eddie Smolov still actively servicing cameras, I would have sent mine to him for a CLA.
It has a better rangefinder (more contrast) than fed 2, the back opens up for even faster loading, and it has an advance film lever instead of a dial.
If Eddie Smolov still actively servicing cameras, I would have sent mine to him for a CLA.
David Hughes
David Hughes
Thanks folks.
Well, I know what you mean about the bodies and yet you have to go to the M series to get an advantage and they aren't cheap to buy or repair. And all mine have had the same counter as the FEDs and Zorkis.
But I'm looking at it from the viewpoint of cheapness - which is how those threads usually start - and print or slide quality.
The point about the Zorki 6 was interesting but not included in the list of bodies as I like the position of the shutter button on the FED 2. I've several cameras with shutter buttons in the "wrong" place and they can be a PITA; especially with electronic ones where the "On/off" switch is where the shutter button should be: I'm looking at a Leica C3 as I type this!
As for them breaking, well, anything second, third or fourth hand will be an unknown quality. My opinion of Leica's and the ex-USSR's cameras of that vintage is that a full service etc is needed sooner or later. I've bills for the M2 and for FED 1's and I know what I prefer and very soon my Leica II (1935) will be going off for the works. But I don't blame it on German engineering.
Brian's point about the cam is interesting but I used to own a Steinheil Culimar lens and so expect to do a bit of (?) adjustment beforehand: luckily I used it on the FED 2 and could get at it from the back with the shutter open and my fingers crossed. From memory the optics unscrewed from the lens barrel and you could free the thing that way as well. It has a cam that wedges in place to stop you unscrewing it from anything without a rotating cam.
The flash socket (non-standard too) on the M2 is not high on my list of carefully thought through design aspects. But - just in case any one sees this as an anti Leica rant - I have dozens of the things and lenses too (film and digital - ask me about the range of lenses for the Digilux 3!) and like them all (even the Z2X) but I like a lot of other cameras too. I was think purely in terms of why do they chose a Leica body and a FSU lens when it ought to be the other way around.
Anyway, thanks everyone and please keep the comments coming.
Regards, David
Well, I know what you mean about the bodies and yet you have to go to the M series to get an advantage and they aren't cheap to buy or repair. And all mine have had the same counter as the FEDs and Zorkis.
But I'm looking at it from the viewpoint of cheapness - which is how those threads usually start - and print or slide quality.
The point about the Zorki 6 was interesting but not included in the list of bodies as I like the position of the shutter button on the FED 2. I've several cameras with shutter buttons in the "wrong" place and they can be a PITA; especially with electronic ones where the "On/off" switch is where the shutter button should be: I'm looking at a Leica C3 as I type this!
As for them breaking, well, anything second, third or fourth hand will be an unknown quality. My opinion of Leica's and the ex-USSR's cameras of that vintage is that a full service etc is needed sooner or later. I've bills for the M2 and for FED 1's and I know what I prefer and very soon my Leica II (1935) will be going off for the works. But I don't blame it on German engineering.
Brian's point about the cam is interesting but I used to own a Steinheil Culimar lens and so expect to do a bit of (?) adjustment beforehand: luckily I used it on the FED 2 and could get at it from the back with the shutter open and my fingers crossed. From memory the optics unscrewed from the lens barrel and you could free the thing that way as well. It has a cam that wedges in place to stop you unscrewing it from anything without a rotating cam.
The flash socket (non-standard too) on the M2 is not high on my list of carefully thought through design aspects. But - just in case any one sees this as an anti Leica rant - I have dozens of the things and lenses too (film and digital - ask me about the range of lenses for the Digilux 3!) and like them all (even the Z2X) but I like a lot of other cameras too. I was think purely in terms of why do they chose a Leica body and a FSU lens when it ought to be the other way around.
Anyway, thanks everyone and please keep the comments coming.
Regards, David
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So, are you stating that anyone who buys a Leica body first is a poser?
Roger Hicks
Mentor
Not sure...
"My" first Leica was a II with 5cm Elmar borrowed from my girlfriend (or possibly fiancée by then) in about 1969. When she asked for it back I had to buy my own IIIa, with a similar lens. In about '74 I bought an M3 and used it with the same Elmar. By then I'd had Summar, Summitar, Summarit, Xenon, and TTH f/2. I choose to go for an M for a far wider choice of more modern lenses, especially wide angles (no Leica-fit lenses from Kobayashi-san in those days, remember) when I could afford them. By the mid-70s, most older Leica lenses were seen as variable in quality (some great, some, including the majority of wide-angles, indifferent, with a few very pricey exceptions) and most competitors did not enjoy the near-worship they attract today. Canons were seen as OK but outdated and FSU lenses (current SU lenses, then) were seen for what they were: cheap entertainment with more QC misses than hits.
So maybe it makes more sense to go for an M-mount body and a cheap lens, with an option on a better lens later. To Shadowfox I'd say that quite honestly, I'd not touch a Zorkii 6 instead of a Leica-M, Voigtländer or ZI as a 'daily user', on the grounds of ergonomics, never mind build quality. But then, I'd not buy a screw-mount Leica instead of an M either, as a photographic tool. As fun, entertainment, etc., yes, sure, but even then I'd probably prefer a Retina IIa.
Then again, this is the opinion of a 61-year-old who has been using Leicas since about 1969. It's hard to put myself in the shoes of (say) a 21 year old in 2011.
Cheers,
R.
"My" first Leica was a II with 5cm Elmar borrowed from my girlfriend (or possibly fiancée by then) in about 1969. When she asked for it back I had to buy my own IIIa, with a similar lens. In about '74 I bought an M3 and used it with the same Elmar. By then I'd had Summar, Summitar, Summarit, Xenon, and TTH f/2. I choose to go for an M for a far wider choice of more modern lenses, especially wide angles (no Leica-fit lenses from Kobayashi-san in those days, remember) when I could afford them. By the mid-70s, most older Leica lenses were seen as variable in quality (some great, some, including the majority of wide-angles, indifferent, with a few very pricey exceptions) and most competitors did not enjoy the near-worship they attract today. Canons were seen as OK but outdated and FSU lenses (current SU lenses, then) were seen for what they were: cheap entertainment with more QC misses than hits.
So maybe it makes more sense to go for an M-mount body and a cheap lens, with an option on a better lens later. To Shadowfox I'd say that quite honestly, I'd not touch a Zorkii 6 instead of a Leica-M, Voigtländer or ZI as a 'daily user', on the grounds of ergonomics, never mind build quality. But then, I'd not buy a screw-mount Leica instead of an M either, as a photographic tool. As fun, entertainment, etc., yes, sure, but even then I'd probably prefer a Retina IIa.
Then again, this is the opinion of a 61-year-old who has been using Leicas since about 1969. It's hard to put myself in the shoes of (say) a 21 year old in 2011.
Cheers,
R.
mooge
Well-known
wolves3012
Mentor
I use an Industar 22 on a Leica IIIC. I wanted a Barnack Leica and didn't see the need for a Leica lens at Leica prices, having seen what the I-22 is capable of.
shadowfox
Darkroom printing lives
Huh?
What position of shutter button are you referring to?
Both Fed 2 and Zorki 6 requires (if you want to shoot comfortably) the use your right index finger. Where's the difference?
If you're talking about some Exaktas, now those are different.
Valkir1987
Well-known
The Zorki 6 has the release in the center of the winding lever and exposure counter. The Fed 2 has the release at the top of the rewind collar. I vote both camera's are decent and very well built. Still recommend and prefer the Zorki6. The 6 has been my slide film shooting companion for about 2 years now.
However, my Fed 2 is loaded at the moment. And I maybe dare to try my dad's Summar (not Summitar) on it. The combo looks good.
However, my Fed 2 is loaded at the moment. And I maybe dare to try my dad's Summar (not Summitar) on it. The combo looks good.
froyd
Mentor
edonism?
edonism?
I suspect that for many of the members of this forum, photography is a pleasurable hobby that is pursued for the satisfactions it offers. It has been said many times before, on this very site, that we should enjoy the photographic journey as well as the destination.
For me, the journey includes the tactile pleasure of working with a finely crafted instrument. Mind you, this comes from somebody who only owned a lowly Bessa. However, a simple walk around town for me is greatly improved if I have a camera around my neck, and and it becomes even more enjoyable if the camera is a pleasure to operate and the finder is a joy to peer through.
edonism?
I suspect that for many of the members of this forum, photography is a pleasurable hobby that is pursued for the satisfactions it offers. It has been said many times before, on this very site, that we should enjoy the photographic journey as well as the destination.
For me, the journey includes the tactile pleasure of working with a finely crafted instrument. Mind you, this comes from somebody who only owned a lowly Bessa. However, a simple walk around town for me is greatly improved if I have a camera around my neck, and and it becomes even more enjoyable if the camera is a pleasure to operate and the finder is a joy to peer through.
Roger Hicks
Mentor
Nomad Z
Well-known
What makes you think that? Have you asked them all?
pakeha
Well-known
No, i think Neare will be referring to the first line of the OP.
Which stated that many who buy a Leica want to know which 20.00 buck lense they should attach to it.
Kinda like a Rolex with a G-shock strap. A Maserati with re-tread tyres..etc.etc.
I don`t think Neare was trying to insult anyone, except that there are a lot of people very easily offended these days.
regards
CW