peterm1
Mentor
The other day I had to go into my local camera store and happened to see they had a nice Sony A7s (first version) in impeccable condition. I looked at it closely but initially was not sure about it - though when I went home I was interested enough to undertake some internet research focusing on its various reviews. I had previously thought about buying a later version of an A7 series camera eventually but had thought it most likely would be an A7r 2 or something of that sort. But the A7s did pique my interest as I have been thinking of trying my hand at video making and this camera is optimized for that function as I found out when I researched it online.
Anyhooooooo yesterday I bought it. I own no full frame Sony lenses (just 2 cropped lenses for NEX series cameras) and have not, in any event had a chance to test it comprehensively. But last night using an adapter and Leica M mount lenses, I snapped some shots of my cat sitting in darkened conditions in my study - pretty much lit by little more than my computer screen in some instances and by a small desk lamp in others and I have to say that this camera's reputation for the ability to turn in beautiful and sharp low light shots as well as shots in better light with very good dynamic range, good contrast and good color seems to be well deserved. Though I do not think I went beyond about ISO 3200 or a little above and have not tested it out to ISO 12000 which it is said to handle quite well. One nice surprise is that its viewfinder - though being the same resolution as that on my NEX 7 performs substantially better especially in low light - the NEX's finder is exceedingly noisy with lots of color noise, especially in this lighting situation. In fact its performance is worse than the top mounted Sony OLED finder for cameras like the NEX f3 which I found to have quite good low light performance considering. On the other hand, the 7s finder was clean without discernable noise and nicely lit even in dim conditions. It seems as if Sony has found a way to boost the finder's performance as well as the sensors' - as they should given this camera's credentials.
Later today when I have time I will process and post a few shots a little later so people here can see some samples but am interested to see if any one else has experience of this camera and what you think. BTW the comparatively small sensor resolution (12 mp) seems to concern me less than I thought it would and will do so even less if it continues to turn in such lovely photos.
Anyhooooooo yesterday I bought it. I own no full frame Sony lenses (just 2 cropped lenses for NEX series cameras) and have not, in any event had a chance to test it comprehensively. But last night using an adapter and Leica M mount lenses, I snapped some shots of my cat sitting in darkened conditions in my study - pretty much lit by little more than my computer screen in some instances and by a small desk lamp in others and I have to say that this camera's reputation for the ability to turn in beautiful and sharp low light shots as well as shots in better light with very good dynamic range, good contrast and good color seems to be well deserved. Though I do not think I went beyond about ISO 3200 or a little above and have not tested it out to ISO 12000 which it is said to handle quite well. One nice surprise is that its viewfinder - though being the same resolution as that on my NEX 7 performs substantially better especially in low light - the NEX's finder is exceedingly noisy with lots of color noise, especially in this lighting situation. In fact its performance is worse than the top mounted Sony OLED finder for cameras like the NEX f3 which I found to have quite good low light performance considering. On the other hand, the 7s finder was clean without discernable noise and nicely lit even in dim conditions. It seems as if Sony has found a way to boost the finder's performance as well as the sensors' - as they should given this camera's credentials.
Later today when I have time I will process and post a few shots a little later so people here can see some samples but am interested to see if any one else has experience of this camera and what you think. BTW the comparatively small sensor resolution (12 mp) seems to concern me less than I thought it would and will do so even less if it continues to turn in such lovely photos.
Larry H-L
Well-known
I have had a 7s for several years and it has proven to be a very good camera. The low-light performance is excellent. In my opinion it gives better results with native Sony/Zeiss glass, or with adapted SLR lenses. RF lenses sometimes show some softness in the corners.
The biggest downside is battery life. Buy 6 extras. The newer A7 series cameras use a much larger battery for better life.
The biggest downside is battery life. Buy 6 extras. The newer A7 series cameras use a much larger battery for better life.
peterm1
Mentor
Thank you for this. As it happens I do already have about 6 spare batteries due to them being the same as the ones used by the NEX. Which I presume is also part of the problem with battery life when used with this camera. They are not all that good even with the NEX cameras. I saw in the shop when I bought this a A7R 11 in fairly rough condition for a few hundred more $ so was not tempted to buy it principally due to it having had a hard life. But I very much liked the fatter body and the larger handgrip. I have moderately large hands and it suited me perfectly in that regard. The camera guy told me that the fatter body is attributable to the large physical size of the new battery now being used for this range.
The one thing that slightly disappoints me is that as I understand it the AF adapters available to provide M lenses with AF on Sony cameras will not function properly on my generation of camera - the next one having upgraded AF technology. Still that is clearly not a deal breaker though it would have been nice now and then when I am feeling lazy revert to AF.
Nice to hear your comments about how well the images produced by legacy lenses look when taken on this camera. In my very short test so far I certainly would not disagree.
madNbad
Well-known
You just solved the problem about using a bellows attachment to scan negatives. My A7II spends most of it time on the copy stand but I did add a 35 2.0 Zeiss Loxia for digital adventures.
maddoc
... likes film again.
I have mine now a little over 3 weeks and I have to say that I am positively surprised about general handling, manual focusing aids, the EVF quality and writing speed. I have tested the camera with a couple of my older Leica M-mount and L-mount adapters and got some nice shots. The most surprising lens however was a recent purchase of the 28mm f/2.0 FE from Sony. Very cheap, quick AF, and decent quality of the photos. For me it is the poor man's Leica Q. I also bought an E-mount F-mount adapter and want to use it to scan film with my 50/1.8 and some extension tubes.
Sony A7, FE 28 f/2.0
Sony A7, FE 28 f/2.0
peterm1
Mentor
Yes you are right. It does leave me however with the fact that it only has a 12 megapixel sensor but I will not obsess over that issue till I try it out. If push comes to shove I suppose I could revert to using a my Sony NEX 7 which has 24 megapixels be I am then back in the land of the cropped sensor............In either event as the bellows is for Pentax M42 mount it does limit me a bit though I do own some suitable lenses now that a macro lens is not essential.
maddoc
... likes film again.
If your A7 is the ILCE-7 then it has a 24.3 MP sensor. To my knowledge, there was no A7 model with less than 24.3 MP.
peterm1
Mentor
I have mine now a little over 3 weeks and I have to say that I am positively surprised about general handling, manual focusing aids, the EVF quality and writing speed. I have tested the camera with a couple of my older Leica M-mount and L-mount adapters and got some nice shots. The most surprising lens however was a recent purchase of the 28mm f/2.0 FE from Sony. Very cheap, quick AF, and decent quality of the photos. For me it is the poor man's Leica Q. I also bought an E-mount F-mount adapter and want to use it to scan film with my 50/1.8 and some extension tubes.
Sony A7, FE 28 f/2.0
Thanks for this Maddoc. May I ask about your experience with high ISO shots? The shot you provided certainly looks good.
As you may have seen in my other thread, I have also been looking into scanning options and of course lenses to go with it. As I mentioned there, I have just now given in to the urge to buy a bellows attachment with M42 mounts (good price, well made Pentax brand and M42 is always an easy mount to work with relatively speaking). M42 is not a problem with regard to the camera I will use as I have adapters for several lens systems for Sony including a couple in M42. But it does limit me somewhat to using an M42 lens at the other end unless I can work out a suitable adapter stacking regime. (I can for example find an M39-M42 ring adapter and use that to mount Leica LTM glass I suppose but would prefer to use a later Leica M lens given the techncial quality - if not always the artistic qualities of those are better). As a result I will probably use the SMC Takumar 55mm f1.8 the last version in M42) which is excellent.
I also own the Nikkor in 50mm f1.8 (early pre AI but AI converted) and have always had an exceedingly high regard for both its sharpness and rendering. It is simply amazing. As I have a Nikkor to Sony adapter I will no doubt try it on the R7s in the near term.
mcfingon
Western Australia
Peter, I have had an A7S for 5 years, but recently traded it for an A7III. I found the Elmar Leica lenses worked best of the RF lenses on the A7S. I have given in on the A7III and gone for the native lenses. The Sony Macro 50/2.8 is inexpensive second hand. I got a lovely one for $390 Aus on eBay.
John Mc
John Mc
mcfingon
Western Australia
On the scanning side, I use a D3500 Nikon and 40 Micro-Nikkor for inexpensive and fast scanning. I agree the 50/1.8 Nikkor is very good and can confirm it works well on the Sony A7S.
John Mc
John Mc
maddoc
... likes film again.
That shot was ISO 3200, 1/80s, f/2.0
I think up to 6400 the camera works well, I saw reports that contemporary Nikon or Canon DSLR were better regarding high ISO. However, I can say that a photo as the one I have shown would not have been possible using film. The grain would not have allowed for many details.
Having not planned to buy the Sony, I bought the Nikkor AF-G 60/2.8 Macro earlier the year to use it with a D3200 but as a G lens without aperture control ring (need to check) it won't be able to be used with the Sony. A non-macro lens gives better results with a reverse mount ring. But anyhow, the digital camera scans are faster and of equal quality than those with the Nikon Coolscan 4000ED
I think up to 6400 the camera works well, I saw reports that contemporary Nikon or Canon DSLR were better regarding high ISO. However, I can say that a photo as the one I have shown would not have been possible using film. The grain would not have allowed for many details.
Having not planned to buy the Sony, I bought the Nikkor AF-G 60/2.8 Macro earlier the year to use it with a D3200 but as a G lens without aperture control ring (need to check) it won't be able to be used with the Sony. A non-macro lens gives better results with a reverse mount ring. But anyhow, the digital camera scans are faster and of equal quality than those with the Nikon Coolscan 4000ED
mcfingon
Western Australia
mcfingon
Western Australia
If you buy a Nikon G to Sony adapter, you control the aperture of the G lens using a rotating collar on the adapter. The Nikon F to Sony adapters don’t have that bit.
maddoc
... likes film again.
Thanks a lot for that information. Actual my adapter has a aperture control ring but with a different scale than the usual aperture scale. Maybe it is a Nikon G to E mount adapter? I will check later at home.
mcfingon
Western Australia
Sounds like the right one Gabor. They don’t use aperture scale numbers on the adapters because that’s a variable. Usually they are just saying 1 stop shut down from wide open, 2 stops and so on.
maddoc
... likes film again.
That of course makes a lot of sense since the starting (largest) aperture might differ between different lenses.
sebastel
coarse art umbrascriptor
for a while, i use the A7 (not the S, though) for "scanning" 135 negatives.
i use a pentax M42 macro bellows, and a 50mm f/4 SMC. only small prob is some vignetting towards the border of the frame, caused by a rather narrow window on the negative holder.
i also use the A7 as a traveling camera. best WA option is again a pentax, the pentax-m 20mm f/4.
Peter, enjoy it, and don't let the sometimes confusing menu get you.
cheers,
sebastian
i use a pentax M42 macro bellows, and a 50mm f/4 SMC. only small prob is some vignetting towards the border of the frame, caused by a rather narrow window on the negative holder.
i also use the A7 as a traveling camera. best WA option is again a pentax, the pentax-m 20mm f/4.
Peter, enjoy it, and don't let the sometimes confusing menu get you.
cheers,
sebastian
ruby.monkey
Mentor
I have the A7SII, mainly to avoid the compressed raw of the original A7 series. Lousy autofocus, terrible button layout, but a superb mount for manual-focus lenses; and as with the A7S, low-light performance that borders on the ridiculous.
For all its flaws, I love it - just wish Sony had carried over the control dials from the first model.
For all its flaws, I love it - just wish Sony had carried over the control dials from the first model.
peterm1
Mentor
for a while, i use the A7 (not the S, though) for "scanning" 135 negatives.
i use a pentax M42 macro bellows, and a 50mm f/4 SMC. only small prob is some vignetting towards the border of the frame, caused by a rather narrow window on the negative holder.
i also use the A7 as a traveling camera. best WA option is again a pentax, the pentax-m 20mm f/4.
Peter, enjoy it, and don't let the sometimes confusing menu get you.
cheers,
sebastian
Thanks for this Sebastian. I am finding the menu to be a real headscratcher. And Sony's handling of certain situations seems plainly odd. Like the random messages that seem to pop up saying this function or that function is invalid in this mode - some of these seem idiosyncratic. Also one thing that gripes me is when a button is assigned to be the button for magnifying the image for critical focusing in MF mode, you need to press it twice to activate that function - the first brings up what I suppose are framelines (which I am guessing can be moved around though I have not tried) then a second time to actually cause the enlargement. I would prefer the ability to turn off step 1 as I am happy to go with the enlargement of a centrally located point then move the camera to reframe when critical focus has been achieved - it all seems much quicker and more natural to do it this way. They are just a couple of things I found. I am sure there are plenty more aggravations awaiting me. It kind of reminds me of when I first drove a modern German car - full of weird interlocks that allow you do do something when some settings are activated but not in others. It is supposed to avoid mistakes but I find it to be aggravating and makes the learning curve much more steep. Still I will push on. Other than that it seems to be a remarkably effective camera in the image department. The few images I have made to date impress me greatly from a technical perspective.
Ricoh
Well-known
Can I join the party?
All this talk here has reignited my interest.
I’m a Leica RF user, primarily, but also Nikon and Pentax SLR. As such I have an array of lenses. When I get bored I start looking / researching mirrorless cameras as a surrogate for my manual focus warehouse-full....
I’m torn between the Nikon Z6 and the Sony A7x (the Sony nomenclature is really confusing, do they do it on purpose?). The question I have is this: how effective is focus peaking on the Sony A7x, speed of response, and if image magnification is required to be able to see the peak of focus how distracting is it, and how long does the image return to normal once the button is released?
Similar questions about the Z6 need to live elsewhere, so I’ll not mention here.
All this talk here has reignited my interest.
I’m a Leica RF user, primarily, but also Nikon and Pentax SLR. As such I have an array of lenses. When I get bored I start looking / researching mirrorless cameras as a surrogate for my manual focus warehouse-full....
I’m torn between the Nikon Z6 and the Sony A7x (the Sony nomenclature is really confusing, do they do it on purpose?). The question I have is this: how effective is focus peaking on the Sony A7x, speed of response, and if image magnification is required to be able to see the peak of focus how distracting is it, and how long does the image return to normal once the button is released?
Similar questions about the Z6 need to live elsewhere, so I’ll not mention here.