Luddite Frank
Well-known
Anybody have one / use one ?
Not an "RF", strictly speaking, but a cousin to the Graphic field cameras...
LF
Not an "RF", strictly speaking, but a cousin to the Graphic field cameras...
LF
x-ray
Mentor
I had a friend who owned one. It belonged to a photographer I worked for in the early 70's for a very short time. Both are deceased now and I'm not sure what happened to it. I did however make contact prints from the negs.
There are quite a few variations of them. Film size varied I believe from 6" to 16" but might be wrong on the specifics. Several companies made them if I remember correctly. Many had a triple convertible Turner Reich lens but there were variations again. One thing that was critical was the lens had to perfectly match the gear set with the camera. The original lens was separated from the camera my friend had and my friend spent years trying to match one to it with no success. Let me emphasize a perfect match is critical. Each focal length of the triple convertible lens required a different set of gears. Each gear set also required a different governor for various effective shutter speeds. Some used rotating fan blades and others used a different type of mechanical governor system.
The wooden tripod had a turntable on it with a gear that had to mesh with the speed gears and governor set for each focal length. Everything had to run perfectly smooth too. My friends camera would stutter at one point in the rotation causing a black band in the neg. The gears we're work from 5 years of use.
I think this one was a #10 using 10" film. The roll back snapped off the camera body and a regular 8x10 spring back went on it so you could use it as an 8x10 view camera with movements.
In circuit mode negs ranged from a couple of feet up to about 6 feet long depending on the lens FL and angle of Arc you wanted to shoot. I have a couple of images I'm in from when I received my masters in chicago. The camera swung fairly slowly so it was common for a person on the front end of the exposure to run from one end to the other during the exposure and appear on the other end.
For quite a few years I had a modern circuit camera. I owned a Roundshot 35/35 with a 28mm lens. A full 360 degree image took about 11" of film but fractions of a 360 could also be shot. Shutter speeds we're variable by adjusting the slit over the film and the aperture was variable. These are amazing high quality Swiss cameras and lenses. I did many shots with it for annual reports and golf courses. I did many sunrise and sunset shots on golf courses and produced very impressive 12 and 24 foot murals from them.
There are quite a few variations of them. Film size varied I believe from 6" to 16" but might be wrong on the specifics. Several companies made them if I remember correctly. Many had a triple convertible Turner Reich lens but there were variations again. One thing that was critical was the lens had to perfectly match the gear set with the camera. The original lens was separated from the camera my friend had and my friend spent years trying to match one to it with no success. Let me emphasize a perfect match is critical. Each focal length of the triple convertible lens required a different set of gears. Each gear set also required a different governor for various effective shutter speeds. Some used rotating fan blades and others used a different type of mechanical governor system.
The wooden tripod had a turntable on it with a gear that had to mesh with the speed gears and governor set for each focal length. Everything had to run perfectly smooth too. My friends camera would stutter at one point in the rotation causing a black band in the neg. The gears we're work from 5 years of use.
I think this one was a #10 using 10" film. The roll back snapped off the camera body and a regular 8x10 spring back went on it so you could use it as an 8x10 view camera with movements.
In circuit mode negs ranged from a couple of feet up to about 6 feet long depending on the lens FL and angle of Arc you wanted to shoot. I have a couple of images I'm in from when I received my masters in chicago. The camera swung fairly slowly so it was common for a person on the front end of the exposure to run from one end to the other during the exposure and appear on the other end.
For quite a few years I had a modern circuit camera. I owned a Roundshot 35/35 with a 28mm lens. A full 360 degree image took about 11" of film but fractions of a 360 could also be shot. Shutter speeds we're variable by adjusting the slit over the film and the aperture was variable. These are amazing high quality Swiss cameras and lenses. I did many shots with it for annual reports and golf courses. I did many sunrise and sunset shots on golf courses and produced very impressive 12 and 24 foot murals from them.
x-ray
Mentor
I checked and Igor Camera still has a complete #8 with lens, tripod, gears and keys. The problem now is getting film. My friend who wound up with one used 220 film to test lenses in hopes of finding the correct one. I guess now you could get Ilford to coat some but you'd need a couple of film spools. If you had one you could have them machined I guess. I'm not sure if the group still exists but there was at one time a panoramic society. You might Google it. Seems like it was out of Florida but not sure.
If you are serious about doing 360's on film, look at a used Roundshot. The company is still in business and making very expensive digital systems. There were several models made. I had the 35/35 and there was a 35/35s. The S had two motors, one for upper speeds and one for very long ones. I failed to mention these are electric. There was also a 120/220 model that had interchangeable lenses. They only worked with a 28mm and came in Nikon and Leicaflex mount. The Nikon was most popular because the 28mm PC lens had huge coverage and worked better.
There was a 65mm version too with fixed lens and a version that used different FL lenses. I think it came in Mamiya medium format mount and Nikon and seem to remember Hasselblad mount. You could use different FL lenses and program the computer for the lens so it would rotate on the lenses nodal point. If it wasn't rotating on that point the neg would just be a blur. I think this model took 120/220. It might have come in 70mm but not certain. I think there's one on eBay right now.
If you are serious about doing 360's on film, look at a used Roundshot. The company is still in business and making very expensive digital systems. There were several models made. I had the 35/35 and there was a 35/35s. The S had two motors, one for upper speeds and one for very long ones. I failed to mention these are electric. There was also a 120/220 model that had interchangeable lenses. They only worked with a 28mm and came in Nikon and Leicaflex mount. The Nikon was most popular because the 28mm PC lens had huge coverage and worked better.
There was a 65mm version too with fixed lens and a version that used different FL lenses. I think it came in Mamiya medium format mount and Nikon and seem to remember Hasselblad mount. You could use different FL lenses and program the computer for the lens so it would rotate on the lenses nodal point. If it wasn't rotating on that point the neg would just be a blur. I think this model took 120/220. It might have come in 70mm but not certain. I think there's one on eBay right now.
x-ray
Mentor
I looked at the bayand there's 28/220, a 65/5 and a 35/35 on there. The super 220VR with interchangable lenses sold. I think the VR was in the $20,000 plus range when new. In any case all of them were very expensive.
farlymac
PF McFarland
I've got one of those Cirkut negatives from around 1935. It's in large format, and came rolled in a tube. The local lab said they could scan it in sections, then I could paste the files together so they could print it on one of their roll printers. After a while though I no longer trusted them to even do that simple of an operation. I figured one of them would cut the negative up to make it easier to fit on the scanner.
PF
PF
Luddite Frank
Well-known
Thanks for the replies.
Looking into it a bit more, this would be a relationship not to be entered into lightly...
LF
Looking into it a bit more, this would be a relationship not to be entered into lightly...
LF
raydm6
Yay! Cameras! 🙈🙉🙊┌( ಠ_ಠ)┘ [◉"]
Neat little article about the Cirkut Camera camera and the photographer who uses it:
petapixel.com
I've seen these late-1800's/early-1900's panoramics at town halls or antique shops. I wonder if they were shot with a camera such as this or similar?
100-Year-Old 360-Degree Film Camera That Uses 98-Feet Long Film
He has to order enormous rolls of film.
petapixel.com
I've seen these late-1800's/early-1900's panoramics at town halls or antique shops. I wonder if they were shot with a camera such as this or similar?
x-ray
Mentor
Interesting this story has resurfaced. I think Igor still has the same one for sale.
Today it’s so easy to shoot panoramas that most people do stills and stitch them. My Fuji X-T3 will shoot a series of images and stitch them in camera. It’s very cool and easy but lacks the romance of those great old cameras.
These were shot with the Fuji stitching in camera.
Today it’s so easy to shoot panoramas that most people do stills and stitch them. My Fuji X-T3 will shoot a series of images and stitch them in camera. It’s very cool and easy but lacks the romance of those great old cameras.
These were shot with the Fuji stitching in camera.
Attachments
Particular
a.k.a. CNNY, disassembler
Here is an interview with Kenneth Snelson from the 80's that shows him using a Cirkut camera, and riding it around on the back of his bike. Watch to the end to see the contact printer that he built for these big negatives.
Freakscene
Obscure member
We had out high school graduating class photo taken using one. They move remarkably slowly. One of the guys was at one end, and as soon as he figured the lens had moved away from his starting point, he jumped down, ran behind everyone else and placed himself at the other end. So there are 2 of him in the photo. Makes me laugh every time. I was really short (only ended up 173cm / 5’8”) but not on the end of my row. No possibility to duplicate myself.
Ilford are still making 8” rolls and 10” rolls for these cameras. I don’t think there is any colour film for them anymore. A shame.
Ilford are still making 8” rolls and 10” rolls for these cameras. I don’t think there is any colour film for them anymore. A shame.
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Mark C
Well-known
I shot a Cirkut #10 for many years but don't get it out much anymore, though I still have plenty of film in the freezer. Igor sold a #10 recently but I believe has another one. Igor also bought quite a bit of film for #10 recently. Richard Malogorski from the link a few posts up does amazing things with a Cirkut. Euphus Ruth has been shooting with a #10 in Mississippi. I know of a #16 (16" film like Kenneth Snelson is using in the video) being restored in California. There was a revival of interest in these in the 80's, but far fewer people shooting them today for obvious reasons. They are still an amazing camera to work with though.
markjwyatt
Well-known
This is kind of like the banquet camera. I have a banquet print (General Petroleum Girls Club) from 1947. The photographer was Weaver (probably Miles Weaver of Los Angeles). He captured 200+ women in a auditorium. You can see some minor motion based distortion (or maybe the photographer used the Schempflug principle for dof), especially near the front. I am not sure the exact operation of these cameras.
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Retro-Grouch
Mentor
I have a masochistic streak when it comes to cameras. Why else would I have just purchased a Rolleiflex 6006? But the Cirkut looks like it could take things to a whole new level off pain. Maybe, after tearing out what little is left of my hair over the Rollei, I could try the Cirkut. More fun than a good flogging!Thanks for the replies.
Looking into it a bit more, this would be a relationship not to be entered into lightly...
LF
x-ray
Mentor
The roundshot I had was a lot of fun. One day I’ll pull some of the negs and scan them and post a few.