Ken Ford
Refuses to suffer fools
I've been using an NEX-7 for two years, first as a supplement to my M6 based kit and then as a functional replacement for the same the majority of the time.
When I originally bought the NEX-7 I expected to mostly be using MF legacy glass (OM and Nikon); as it worked out I found myself using native NEX lenses the vast majority of the time. I like having the AF for most shooting, and I've found having lenses that communicate data to the body is preferable for everyday shooting to ones that don't.
While I like the NEX in general and the -7's EVF and Tri-Navi in particular, spending a recent week shooting my M6 after a few month's lapse followed by a week with my new X100s makes me realize how much better I do with a camera body that has traditional shutter speed on the top deck and aperture concentric around the lens barrel. Because of this, I'm considering moving from the NEX to a Fuji kit based around either an X-E2 or an X-PRO1 with a 23mm, 35mm and 56mm. The 23 and 56 relate well to my Leica 35/75 kit, and I've been appreciating the 35 on my NEX the last few months so would probably want another for the Fuji.
Cut and dried, right? Not quite.
I see all these APS sensor equipped cameras as stopgaps for what I really want - a relatively affordable full frame RF styled body (i.e. with the VF in the upper corner, not in a hump ala the new Sonys) that in addition to having native AF lenses can take my M lenses via adapters. (I'm willing to put up with adapted MF glass if they are my M lenses.
) Because of this, the NEX-7 is and even a new Fuji would just be a way station en route to the final destination, and I'm a little leery of tying up too much disposable cash into something that might be replaced in just a year or two.
So, my dilemma is… spend the dosh now to move to an APS-sized Fuji kit (on the order of $3000) which may get replaced relatively quickly or bide my time with the NEX-7 and see if a full frame Fuji X comes out in the next few years? A third option would be to wait in a dark alley with a truncheon for a hipster carrying a FF digital Leica to wander along, but I'm basically law abiding…
When I originally bought the NEX-7 I expected to mostly be using MF legacy glass (OM and Nikon); as it worked out I found myself using native NEX lenses the vast majority of the time. I like having the AF for most shooting, and I've found having lenses that communicate data to the body is preferable for everyday shooting to ones that don't.
While I like the NEX in general and the -7's EVF and Tri-Navi in particular, spending a recent week shooting my M6 after a few month's lapse followed by a week with my new X100s makes me realize how much better I do with a camera body that has traditional shutter speed on the top deck and aperture concentric around the lens barrel. Because of this, I'm considering moving from the NEX to a Fuji kit based around either an X-E2 or an X-PRO1 with a 23mm, 35mm and 56mm. The 23 and 56 relate well to my Leica 35/75 kit, and I've been appreciating the 35 on my NEX the last few months so would probably want another for the Fuji.
Cut and dried, right? Not quite.
I see all these APS sensor equipped cameras as stopgaps for what I really want - a relatively affordable full frame RF styled body (i.e. with the VF in the upper corner, not in a hump ala the new Sonys) that in addition to having native AF lenses can take my M lenses via adapters. (I'm willing to put up with adapted MF glass if they are my M lenses.
) Because of this, the NEX-7 is and even a new Fuji would just be a way station en route to the final destination, and I'm a little leery of tying up too much disposable cash into something that might be replaced in just a year or two.So, my dilemma is… spend the dosh now to move to an APS-sized Fuji kit (on the order of $3000) which may get replaced relatively quickly or bide my time with the NEX-7 and see if a full frame Fuji X comes out in the next few years? A third option would be to wait in a dark alley with a truncheon for a hipster carrying a FF digital Leica to wander along, but I'm basically law abiding…
back alley
IMAGES
why do i like the fuji gear?
some of this fits for other cameras as well…
i think that aps-c is the sweet spot for digital, i do not need full frame but i want more than m4/3…
the xe1 gives me a rangefinder (feeling) experience more than the other digitals that i have tried (except for the rd1 of course)...
the lenses are much better than i am…no need for better, but am so happy with the quality as it now is…
the gear fits into my favourite bags (bowery/bbb-e)…
affordable…more so than some other gear…
is fuji the best? who really cares…nowadays the quality of most of the gear available if beyond what i need…it's certainly good enough for me...
some of this fits for other cameras as well…
i think that aps-c is the sweet spot for digital, i do not need full frame but i want more than m4/3…
the xe1 gives me a rangefinder (feeling) experience more than the other digitals that i have tried (except for the rd1 of course)...
the lenses are much better than i am…no need for better, but am so happy with the quality as it now is…
the gear fits into my favourite bags (bowery/bbb-e)…
affordable…more so than some other gear…
is fuji the best? who really cares…nowadays the quality of most of the gear available if beyond what i need…it's certainly good enough for me...
Ken Ford
Refuses to suffer fools
The main thing driving me to Fuji is the traditional controls and the RF position VF. I'm happy with APS-C EXCEPT for wanting to use my M glass at their designed FOVs.
I really do think it's likely that Fuji will release a FF X series body with an X-E or X-PRO form factor. At least, I hope it happens.
YYV_146
Well-known
Shooting Leica lenses on the A7 and you get both the on-lens aperture barrel and a top mount exposure compensation dial. Not as good as a shutter speed dial, but almost identical in functionality.
IMO nobody needs FF, but Sony and the others won't be standing still. Leica may very well have a FF EVF-only body in the works, and rumor goes that Sony will bring out a high-speed 12mp A7s body this weekend...With Fuji you might feel left in the dust a few years down the road, when FF bodies hit the sub-$1000 mark.
IMO nobody needs FF, but Sony and the others won't be standing still. Leica may very well have a FF EVF-only body in the works, and rumor goes that Sony will bring out a high-speed 12mp A7s body this weekend...With Fuji you might feel left in the dust a few years down the road, when FF bodies hit the sub-$1000 mark.
YYV_146
Well-known
BTW I've used the NEX-7 for over two years. The A7 really does feel like a natural upgrade. I still don't like the centered EVF, but apart from mashing my nose into the LCD I haven't found any operational differences...
Now I have two A7s, but still use the NEX-7 quite often...here's a shot with the 35mm Summilux ASPH
Now I have two A7s, but still use the NEX-7 quite often...here's a shot with the 35mm Summilux ASPH
SausalitoDog
Well-known
I understand your desire to make use of the legacy Leica glass.
I didn't have any, so I bought an Elmarit 28mm little black beauty...it feels like a rolex of lenses...but...I only used it a couple of afternoons and went back to the fuji lenses...just couldn't see giving up the auto focus when I wanted it for no real apparent uptick in IQ, just an uptick in "beauty" and it was also quite a bit heavier.
Hard to say what to do in the choice of xe2 vs. xp1. The hybrid finder is a strong feature...the size and ability of the xe2 is pretty phenomenal... No bad choice here.
Nice choices to be pondering
I didn't have any, so I bought an Elmarit 28mm little black beauty...it feels like a rolex of lenses...but...I only used it a couple of afternoons and went back to the fuji lenses...just couldn't see giving up the auto focus when I wanted it for no real apparent uptick in IQ, just an uptick in "beauty" and it was also quite a bit heavier.
Hard to say what to do in the choice of xe2 vs. xp1. The hybrid finder is a strong feature...the size and ability of the xe2 is pretty phenomenal... No bad choice here.
Nice choices to be pondering
Scrambler
Well-known
This type of discussion brings out everyone's personal preferences but rarely useful info for the OP.
My own preferences are quite different but I can see where you are going.
Firstly, as one of a generation that learned on film SLRs I can say that future retro offerings are unlikely to offer left side viewfinders.
As for APS, I forced myself to overcome this same want. If the adapted lenses cover the range of moderate wide to moderate long, I think that is all you can expect. The image circle on some of these lenses will cover MF but not many people even try. For RF equivalence I think provided you have something on the 18-21 mm range at the wide end you have a full range of focal lengths available. I could even be convinced that 25 would be wide enough. The intended view is a mental gotcha not a physical reality.
Because dual wheel controls have been the norm in SLRs for the last 25 years I don't see this being replaced by traditional dials so I personally wouldn't wait for a FF option that matches your preferred ergonomics.
My own preferences are quite different but I can see where you are going.
Firstly, as one of a generation that learned on film SLRs I can say that future retro offerings are unlikely to offer left side viewfinders.
As for APS, I forced myself to overcome this same want. If the adapted lenses cover the range of moderate wide to moderate long, I think that is all you can expect. The image circle on some of these lenses will cover MF but not many people even try. For RF equivalence I think provided you have something on the 18-21 mm range at the wide end you have a full range of focal lengths available. I could even be convinced that 25 would be wide enough. The intended view is a mental gotcha not a physical reality.
Because dual wheel controls have been the norm in SLRs for the last 25 years I don't see this being replaced by traditional dials so I personally wouldn't wait for a FF option that matches your preferred ergonomics.
Georgiy Romanov
stray cat
It's not so difficult to make our decision simple. I like RF and would like to have digital leica, because this is the best solution for those who love rangefinders.
In past three years i shoot film on price of good used M9. But it must be a three "saving your money" years and another three to justify the price of the camera if i decide buy one. From my perspective try something better can be a enemy of something good. Taking into count that not size of the sensor make me happy but ergonomics and convenience of camera I calm down.
I have old M4 with good lens and enjoy classic style of shooting. This combo will work more time than any digital camera. And also i have cheapo digital cameras which can produces pictures with superb quality to save my money for trips and anything else. They also give me other shooting experience.
Just do what your soul ask and have fun. Fun is the keyword
In past three years i shoot film on price of good used M9. But it must be a three "saving your money" years and another three to justify the price of the camera if i decide buy one. From my perspective try something better can be a enemy of something good. Taking into count that not size of the sensor make me happy but ergonomics and convenience of camera I calm down.
I have old M4 with good lens and enjoy classic style of shooting. This combo will work more time than any digital camera. And also i have cheapo digital cameras which can produces pictures with superb quality to save my money for trips and anything else. They also give me other shooting experience.
Just do what your soul ask and have fun. Fun is the keyword
gavinlg
Mentor
I think once you use the fuji natives on the camera you won't particularly want to use the M lenses. They are out of their element on a digital non-M body.
The fuji lenses are superb.
The fuji lenses are superb.
bobbyrab
Well-known
Having just bought an x-pro1, it might be too early for me to say, but I can see that the increased depth of focus from the smaller sensor could well result in more keepers than shooting ff, without looking obviously different from ff. By that I mean I don't think you could identify an image from the Fuji as not being from ff, it has ff character but shot at the same f stop is more detail rich with the greater dof.
My entry into digital was a Canon 20d with the same crop, but I didn't like that camera and my next 5d was so much better, I maybe credited the ff aspect of the improvement a little too much. I'm certainly now much more open to the strengths of the smaller sensor.
My entry into digital was a Canon 20d with the same crop, but I didn't like that camera and my next 5d was so much better, I maybe credited the ff aspect of the improvement a little too much. I'm certainly now much more open to the strengths of the smaller sensor.
zuikologist
.........................
Owning both an NEX 7 and XE1 I would stay with the NEX- it feels slicker, better vf with less lag, better manual focus implementation and better controls at least for me. The Super value Sigma lenses (19/30/60mm) are more than good enough although not compact or fast. I do like the XE1 and 27mm combo as a modern day Konica C35 though
Ken Ford
Refuses to suffer fools
After sleeping on this, I'm starting to think staying with the NEX-7 for IC and the X100s for everything else until a full frame option I can afford comes along makes the most sense. I do hold out hope for something in the future like the X-PRO1 in full frame that will have both a good selection of native glass and the ability to play nice with M lenses via an adapter.
Thanks for the ideas and comments, people!
Thanks for the ideas and comments, people!
GaryLH
Mentor
Wait about a year or so.. I suspect u can pick up a a7 for a reasonable price right after they announce the next gen.. .
A ff new camera system from those who do not have one yet in their lineup (Fuji, Pentax/Ricoh, Samsung), I do not think will be lower than the current a7 body price...but I hope I am wrong..
If u are happy enough w/ the nex7..this makes sense.
Gary
. A ff new camera system from those who do not have one yet in their lineup (Fuji, Pentax/Ricoh, Samsung), I do not think will be lower than the current a7 body price...but I hope I am wrong..
If u are happy enough w/ the nex7..this makes sense.
Gary
GaryLH
Mentor
Owning both an NEX 7 and XE1 I would stay with the NEX- it feels slicker, better vf with less lag, better manual focus implementation and better controls at least for me. The Super value Sigma lenses (19/30/60mm) are more than good enough although not compact or fast. I do like the XE1 and 27mm combo as a modern day Konica C35 though
Yep.. Sigma lenses more than make up for the lack of limited good quality prime lenses in the Nex lineup. I wish they would come out w/ a 35f1.4 art series though.
The xe1 w/ 27 is my favorite setup. It reminds me of my Leica/Minolta CL or Contax g2..setup. I wish the af focus wasn't so noisy.
The evf on the xe2 and xt1 are better than the xe1. Have u tried either against your nex7 (just curious)?
I still have my nex5n around as my universal digital back w/ legacy lenses since the Sony has thinness sensor to flange distance. Plus a sigma 30 to use as my main af lens. I never upgraded from it due to
- menu system (new A series menus are so much better now though)
- stupid movie button that always seems to trigger itself (seems to be fixed now in new cameras)
- limited good prime lens selection
- I tend to like Fuji colors better and their lens lineup
So Sony has fixed two of the issues over time.. On the lens front, it looks like Zeiss may become a bigger player here plus I would hope Sigma will come through for them..
Gary
Lss
Well-known
This is (perhaps the only) one of the common NEX-5N complaints that I never found a problem. On the other hand, it has already happened twice on the RX1R.
Ken Ford
Refuses to suffer fools
Gary, it is very unlikely I would ever consider an A7 series Sony. I really dislike the form factor for my style of shooting, and the one I handled did not impress me at all. Superb images, I'm sure - but the overall package is so unappealing I'll pass.
f16sunshine
Moderator
Hi Ken
If you choose the fuji system do it for the lenses.
I adopted early to this system. At first thinking of using my M mount lenses.
Now I use exclusively the Fuji XF 18,35, and recently added a 60 again after testing it earlier and selling (56 will come later).
The size and weight of these lenses on the Xpro is perfect. IQ is superb. Price is damn near disposable compared to alternatives. I sold one M mount lens and paid for all of my Fuji kit.
After nearly two years using this system I would buy again just simply to use the xf35/1.4 lens it's my favorite AF lens ever.
The Sony FE lenses look to be on the same track especially the 1.8/55 so maybe wait for the Sony to bring a better form factor body. The sony FE lenses will always be bigger and heavier if that matters.
You already have the Nex Maybe it's worth it to stay in that system.
If your thought is to pick up Fuji for adapting lenses ... I'm not nearly as enthusiastic about the Xpro or XE bodies. (have not tried the XT1 yet).
my 2c
Cheers!
If you choose the fuji system do it for the lenses.
I adopted early to this system. At first thinking of using my M mount lenses.
Now I use exclusively the Fuji XF 18,35, and recently added a 60 again after testing it earlier and selling (56 will come later).
The size and weight of these lenses on the Xpro is perfect. IQ is superb. Price is damn near disposable compared to alternatives. I sold one M mount lens and paid for all of my Fuji kit.
After nearly two years using this system I would buy again just simply to use the xf35/1.4 lens it's my favorite AF lens ever.
The Sony FE lenses look to be on the same track especially the 1.8/55 so maybe wait for the Sony to bring a better form factor body. The sony FE lenses will always be bigger and heavier if that matters.
You already have the Nex Maybe it's worth it to stay in that system.
If your thought is to pick up Fuji for adapting lenses ... I'm not nearly as enthusiastic about the Xpro or XE bodies. (have not tried the XT1 yet).
my 2c
Cheers!
zuikologist
.........................
I haven't tried the new Fuji bodies but good to hear they have been improved. I picked up the XE1 because it was cheap and to try the 35/1.4 - not compact, but a great lens.
The NEX7 is fine for me - I cannot see moving on from it any time soon. IC is superb and I tend not to dive into the menus too much or even use the tri-navi wheels much. My absolute favourite thing about the camera is the shutter release - it feels like an old style manual SLR in this respect with minimal lag.
The NEX7 is fine for me - I cannot see moving on from it any time soon. IC is superb and I tend not to dive into the menus too much or even use the tri-navi wheels much. My absolute favourite thing about the camera is the shutter release - it feels like an old style manual SLR in this respect with minimal lag.
cz23
-
I just sent my second A7 back. Like you say, great files, but it felt unrefined to me and not a camera I could live with for a few years.
I've been considering Fuji also, but for different reasons than you, Ken. The Ricoh GR has been a revelation of what's possible for digital BW output and has made me unhappy with the same from the Nex. I thought maybe the X lenses, sensor, and no AA might get me closer to what the GR offers. But there are so many features I like about the Nex, including the pixel count, flip screen, and overall handling, that I think I'll stick with it and see what else the market brings this year.
John
GaryLH
Mentor
It is mainly the way I hold it while walking. I wrap the neck strap around my wrist and carry it one handed. The movie button is easy to trip from that position.. I used the homemade fix of putting an instant rubber compound around the movie button to stop that from happening. Since I really don't shoot movies.. No loss.
Gary