Demise of the ' standard ' lens ?

I have one like this

I have one like this

It's the 3MP FZ3 with fixed 2.8 glass Leica ASPH lens. Probably the best lens Leica has made or designed in the last 2-3 decades.

I've used it for wild bird and whale photos. 8x10s are incredibly sharp.

NickTrop said:
My "zoom lens" is my old (by digital standards) hacked Panny FZ1v2. 12X ASPH optical with image stabilization and f2.8 throughout the zoom range "Leica" lens all in a compact body. Have no issues with the lens or its lowly 2 megapixel count (I have several 8X10's framed from this camera that look perfectly fine to my eyes...) No IR filter means it does double duty with an IR filter. That's my "zoom" lens, and I just love the fact that I have f2.8 throughout the zoom range, unlike the pathetic speed of most zooms. For everything else? I prefer fast primes.

This is an old Washington Post article by Frank Van Ripper lauding this camera.

FZ-1: A Pro-Level Digital Point & Shoot

By Frank Van Riper

Inevitably, the question of pixels will come up. At a flimsy 2.0 megapixels, the FZ-1 certainly sounds anemic. And, one might argue, this shortcoming is one reason Panasonic can charge so comparatively little for it (list around $450; street $375-99).

But I keep coming back to Bruce Dale's spectacular 8x10 images...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/photo/essays/vanRiper/030807.htm

The average price for this camera at the big auction site is "$12.71" with a 0 - $71 dollar range, obviously due to its low megapixel count. But I'm tellin' ya, Frank Van Riper is right about this camera. And if it gets the attention of seasoned pros - really, whatever advances come next doesn't really matter, does it? Proof is in the puddin' and this "outdated" digital produces excellent results (and doubles as an IR camera). I'll never part with it.

The camera itself is a point-n-shooter but there was a firmware hack out on the web (I assume it's still there somewhere), you get aperture and shutter priority.

Mention because that's my stratergy and if someone doesn't want to part with the $$$ for a good (and probably slow) zoom. Just buy a cheaper than dirt (literally, judging from the last time I actually bought dirt) used FZ1. Find the firmware hack if you want more manual control. It's small enough to bring along with you and it's very "SLR"-like in design, handles nicely - like a camera. Need a zoom (or want to shoot IR)? It's FZ1v2. Then a proper fast prime for everything else. There is no substitute for a fast 1.4, 1.7, 1.8, 2.0 prime - esp. a standard 50mm. Per. E. ud. :)
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@ampguy, glad someone on RFF appreciates these early Panny super zooms. And, yes, the glass on these things be it Leica or "Leica" - doesn't matter, simply awesome.
@Bill - I can vouch. Wouldn't part with mine. It's my zoom. Downsides is it goes through batteries - I bring 3 fully charged when I use it, old battery technology proprietary be cheap and easy to find. It gets noisy at 400 but when shooting my kids on stage, I use AP to keep it at f2.8 and let the IS take over at ISO 200. If I need another stop I bump it in Photoshop. The glass on these things is amazing for a truly laughable price. I prefer the FZ2 for its IR capabilities, Panny put that darned IR filter in after the 1st model. And, swear, despite 2 megapixels I have 8X10's from this thing that look great. Yep - that's my "zoom" lens, hasn't let me wanting for a zoom since I bought the thing in '04.
 
NickTrop said:
@ampguy, glad someone on RFF appreciates these early Panny super zooms. And, yes, the glass on these things be it Leica or "Leica" - doesn't matter, simply awesome.
@Bill - I can vouch. Wouldn't part with mine. It's my zoom. Downsides is it goes through batteries - I bring 3 fully charged when I use it, old battery technology proprietary be cheap and easy to find. It gets noisy at 400 but when shooting my kids on stage, I use AP to keep it at f2.8 and let the IS take over at ISO 200. If I need another stop I bump it in Photoshop. The glass on these things is amazing for a truly laughable price. I prefer the FZ2 for its IR capabilities, Panny put that darned IR filter in after the 1st model. And, swear, despite 2 megapixels I have 8X10's from this thing that look great. Yep - that's my "zoom" lens, hasn't let me wanting for a zoom since I bought the thing in '04.
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Were the models that came later any good (except for the IR filter part)? Like say the FZ5? I'm intrigued.
 
bmattock said:
Were the models that came later any good (except for the IR filter part)? Like say the FZ5? I'm intrigued.
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You have every reason to be intrigued - they're intriguing cameras! In answer to your question, I used to participate a lot on the "Steve's Digicam" forum, a few years ago. Lot's of folks shot with the FZ 3, 5's, 10's and 20's back then, with the 20 being the most recent at the time. Great forum, kinda "cult-like" in a good way, just lots of folks having fun with these remarkable cameras. They were all the same basic camera with some improvements, tweaks here and there with, essentially, the same great lens. I "think" (don't quote me) the 5 megapixel FZ 20 was the last model that had the "constant f2.8 through the zoom range" spec before they started using larger and larger sensors for higher megapixel counts but it was a bit larger than the other models. But to me, that's where they jumped the shark - when the cameras started getting a little bigger (the 1, 2, 5 are very compact cameras - look like miniaturized SLRs, handled like a real camera too) and they sacrificed that unique and useful spec of f2.8 though out the zoom range to accommodate the larger sensors. That's my opinion, however. I don't know what "FZ" number they're up to now but they're still highly regarded. Me? If I was interested, I would get a 3 or a 10 - one of the early smaller ones. These cameras are actually great street shooters but with an opposite approach... You shoot waaay over there and zoom in. The IS on these things let you hand hold down to 1/8th fully zoomed out. I'm not really a digital "hater", you see. I see no reason for DSLRs, digital rangefinders, etc. to me they're "in between" technologies in the evolution of digitals. But when they "get it right" I snap them up. This was the case with the early Panny compact super zooms, the Fuji Finepix 10, 20, 30 (high ISO capabilities), and it will (mark my words) be the case with the new Samsung NX10. The ability to shoot with a 2.8 throughout the zoom range, hand-held due to image stabilization with a small light camera is a thing of beauty. Google "Pansonic Lumix FZ review" - tons of reviews on these things. And, you don't have to spend hundreds on these things either, just wait for one of "outdated" early models to pop up. People bypass (the foo's) due to the low megapixel counts.
 
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It seems the normal is set to make a come back. The Pany and Oly m4/3 cams are offered with a Prime kit f1.7/20mm and f2.8/17mm respectively. It looks like the Samsung NX10 will also have such with a f2/30mm. The bokeh fascination by new photogs that has sent the price of some fast 50's from the late 60's through the roof should be well within Canikons radar. It may not be to far off in the future they offer a body/prime kit. They would have to charge a premium which would slow some casual shooter but not "move up'' amateurs.
 
NickTrop said:
Google "Pansonic Lumix FZ review" - tons of reviews on these things. And, you don't have to spend hundreds on these things either, just wait for one of "outdated" early models to pop up. People bypass (the foo's) due to the low megapixel counts.
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Thank you for that. I am going to start poking around a bit.
 
f16sunshine said:
It seems the normal is set to make a come back. The Pany and Oly m4/3 cams are offered with a Prime kit f1.7/20mm and f2.8/17mm respectively. It looks like the Samsung NX10 will also have such with a f2/30mm. The bokeh fascination by new photogs that has sent the price of some fast 50's from the late 60's through the roof should be well within Canikons radar. It may not be to far off in the future they offer a body/prime kit. They would have to charge a premium which would slow some casual shooter but not "move up'' amateurs.
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Samsung - full-sized sensor over the 4/3'rds, a little bigger than the 4/3's - not enough to matter (to me), built-in EVF, jpeg XR for HD vid (if it matters to you - it does to me), latest screen technology ("AMOLED") supposed to be an improvement in bright light. $699 at B&H with kit lens (not out yet, but B&H has it up on their site), a good bit cheaper than that the 4/3's cameras. Slap the 30mm f2 (approx 45mm equiv in 35mm - my favorite focal length) pancake prime on her, and there you have it. The first real digital "rangefinder" - and you don't have to spend $1000's. The only digitals worth a #%@* to me, are: 1. The early Panasonic compact superzooms. These are "must have" cameras. 2. The fuji Finepix with their Super CCD technologies - truly pocketable cameras with a perfectly usable ISO 800 and f2.8 lens at widest aperture. 3. The forthcoming Samsung NX10. Everything else in the consumer digital camera segment - including consumer DSLRs with their slow zooms and over-priced "weird" digital RFs is to me, frankly, pointless. Film cameras? Cheap up front costs for "full frame", great inexpensive fast (by today's standards) basic primes... "pay as you go" with respect to processing and printing costs. Plus the tactile pleasure over digital and the lack of automation forces you to actually think and learn photography.
 
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