Bill Pierce
Well-known
I live in an area where cell phone transmission is almost non existent. Thus my cell phone sits in the car waiting to go to areas where it can function. Since its workload is light, and even lighter during pandemics that cut down on travel, it is an extremely economical model that makes calls, no calculator, no date book, no internet, no games, no movies, no videos, no stills. But the local grocery store now has a parking lot where you can only check into a space by using a cell phone. That’s it - no new, upgraded cell phone means no food, no soap for me, the laundry or the dishes, and no kibble or treats for the dog. Since the upgrade is imperative, why not also get a phone with a good camera. I’m fairly knowledgable about conventional cameras, not at all knowledgable about cameras in phones. But I know that some of you are knowledgable and experienced with the modern wonders. Your advice - what cell phone should a photographer have?
Chriscrawfordphoto
Real Men Shoot Film.
Why the Hell would you need to check in to a parking space? Here in Indiana we'd never tolerate such idiocy. If the store wants our business, they let us park in their lot where ever we can find a space.
boojum
Mentor
Shop somewhere else.
ptpdprinter
Mentor
I would keep the phone you have and just order your groceries over the internet.
I still like the iPhone overall as my phone of choice, but I admit to not using it as serious camera.
Pál_K
Cameras. I has it.
Needing to “check in” for a parking space at a grocery store is insanity - even wacky Washington state doesn’t have that. Customers should refuse, disobey, and go somewhere else.
The trend these days among businesses is to have everyone do things online - that cuts labor costs (and cuts jobs). That is rarely as good as being able to speak to an actual person when a problem needs to be solved.
But, as for phone cameras, I’ve had Android from 2011 through 2020 and an iPhone SE2 since. I’d say neither is better - they’re just different. If you’ve not used a modern smartphone, brace yourself for a shock. No matter whether you get Android or iPhone, you’ll find yourself having to do endless customizations, such as for privacy - not letting your photos reveal your location, etc., etc, and there is no real manual that will describe all the apps and capabilities that are on your phone - not even online. What you’ll be doing is searching the internet for advice on how to do certain things.
Here is an example: on an iPhone, when you make a photo, the default is that it’s a “live” photo. That’s indicated by an icon. What that means, once you’ve researched it, is that what you thought was a single photo, and what seems to be a single photo, is really a 1-second (or so) video. If you want, you can extract a single frame and make that frame your photo. You can also choose to disable live photos. What about the camera click? Can you turn that off? You used to be able to do that independently of your ringer or anything else. It won’t click if the photo is live, but it will click if it’s non-live. What about saving your files as jpg? Nope. It saves them in its own format. At best you can specify jpeg, which should be the exact same thing as jpg, except RFF doesn’t like the jpeg extension. So for every photo I post here from my phone I have to first invoke a third party website to do an idiotic jpeg->jpg conversion. There are dozens of other subtleties.
What I’ve discovered is that although image quality has improved, user-accessible control over the camera and post-processing editing had gotten much worse and that functionality has been pushed into apps (usually not free).
My advice: forget about getting a new phone. Shop somewhere else!
The trend these days among businesses is to have everyone do things online - that cuts labor costs (and cuts jobs). That is rarely as good as being able to speak to an actual person when a problem needs to be solved.
But, as for phone cameras, I’ve had Android from 2011 through 2020 and an iPhone SE2 since. I’d say neither is better - they’re just different. If you’ve not used a modern smartphone, brace yourself for a shock. No matter whether you get Android or iPhone, you’ll find yourself having to do endless customizations, such as for privacy - not letting your photos reveal your location, etc., etc, and there is no real manual that will describe all the apps and capabilities that are on your phone - not even online. What you’ll be doing is searching the internet for advice on how to do certain things.
Here is an example: on an iPhone, when you make a photo, the default is that it’s a “live” photo. That’s indicated by an icon. What that means, once you’ve researched it, is that what you thought was a single photo, and what seems to be a single photo, is really a 1-second (or so) video. If you want, you can extract a single frame and make that frame your photo. You can also choose to disable live photos. What about the camera click? Can you turn that off? You used to be able to do that independently of your ringer or anything else. It won’t click if the photo is live, but it will click if it’s non-live. What about saving your files as jpg? Nope. It saves them in its own format. At best you can specify jpeg, which should be the exact same thing as jpg, except RFF doesn’t like the jpeg extension. So for every photo I post here from my phone I have to first invoke a third party website to do an idiotic jpeg->jpg conversion. There are dozens of other subtleties.
What I’ve discovered is that although image quality has improved, user-accessible control over the camera and post-processing editing had gotten much worse and that functionality has been pushed into apps (usually not free).
My advice: forget about getting a new phone. Shop somewhere else!
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
I recommend something with large screen.
And if you are "freedom fighter" for what you could do, park and so on, Apple is bad choice. It is not North Korea, but worse what Singapore.
Get Android 11. I have something like 160 USD Android 11 phone I paid new at the end of December. It is as good as iPhone 8.
The only problem with Android it doesn't have facetime, if all of your relatives are using facetime, you are more less pooped without iPhone.
PS: I don't think it is plenty of stores to choose from where you are...
And if you are "freedom fighter" for what you could do, park and so on, Apple is bad choice. It is not North Korea, but worse what Singapore.
Get Android 11. I have something like 160 USD Android 11 phone I paid new at the end of December. It is as good as iPhone 8.
The only problem with Android it doesn't have facetime, if all of your relatives are using facetime, you are more less pooped without iPhone.
PS: I don't think it is plenty of stores to choose from where you are...
Richard G
Mentor
Have had iPhones since the 3GS. Currently 11 Pro. It has three separate cameras. The editing software is good. I like the discreet selection of FOV rather than zoom. You can get Apple refurbished examples cheaper. Some apps are great. It’s a slippery slope but you’re being pushed....
Pablito
coco frío
To actually answer your question, I am a professional visual artist and photographer. I use an iPhone 12 ProMax. For routine documentation and non-critical work it has replaced my bigger cameras. I use it all the time for documenting work in progress, and for non-critical photography. You can shoot in RAW, and the lenses are SUPER sharp. The phone has three lenses and the "telephoto" (which is actually more like 55mm or 60mm by 35mm standards is very useful, along with the "normal" lens which is more like a 28. I don't use the ultra-wide as much as I thought I would. If you use Apple computers, the iPhone integrates very nicely. The standard camera has extremely useful features like exposure compensation but you can also get more sophisticated camera apps that let you shoot in "real" raw as opposed to Apple RAW, which does have some processing already baked in. It is very easy to airdrop you raw files to a computer and process them in ACR/ Photoshop if you like.
lynnb
Mentor
Your cell phone uniquely identifies you. It's a bit Big Brother-ish to collect that data, however convenient it is for the grocery store to manage parking. If there's alternative stores available, I'd use those.
Most cell phones now use computational photography. As Pál_K mentioned they take a brief video/multishot sequence and then digitally process it. The quality of the pictures depends as much (maybe more?) on the digital processing as the lens/sensor module(s). It's a highly competitive market so there's often leapfrogging in new phone cameras and processing. Apple and Google Pixel are two of the best out there at present, but others will no doubt challenge them as far as the cameras go. I'd make sure the phone you use has RAW capture as an option.
Just like in cameras the user interface is just as important. I use a Google Pixel 3a (an old model with only one lens and sensor) and I find it easy to use on default auto as a point-and-shoot. The computational side means it doesn't overexpose and it merges multiple images to give good DR, just like other computational phones. I found the Android OS and interface relatively easy to learn and use. Being a Google product it synchronises with Google Calendar and Gmail. Phones with multiple cameras/focal lengths would be more useful, so if I ever upgrade I'd probably look at the latest Pixel which has 3 cameras, just like Apple.
If you're already in the Apple ecosystem the latest Apple is a no-brainer as it would synchronise with Apple mail, calendar, and all the other Apple apps.
Here's a link to some pictures taken with my old-generation, 10Mp Google Pixel 3a. They "look digital", but apart from that the image quality is quite acceptable. This picture shows how well computational photography works.
Most cell phones now use computational photography. As Pál_K mentioned they take a brief video/multishot sequence and then digitally process it. The quality of the pictures depends as much (maybe more?) on the digital processing as the lens/sensor module(s). It's a highly competitive market so there's often leapfrogging in new phone cameras and processing. Apple and Google Pixel are two of the best out there at present, but others will no doubt challenge them as far as the cameras go. I'd make sure the phone you use has RAW capture as an option.
Just like in cameras the user interface is just as important. I use a Google Pixel 3a (an old model with only one lens and sensor) and I find it easy to use on default auto as a point-and-shoot. The computational side means it doesn't overexpose and it merges multiple images to give good DR, just like other computational phones. I found the Android OS and interface relatively easy to learn and use. Being a Google product it synchronises with Google Calendar and Gmail. Phones with multiple cameras/focal lengths would be more useful, so if I ever upgrade I'd probably look at the latest Pixel which has 3 cameras, just like Apple.
If you're already in the Apple ecosystem the latest Apple is a no-brainer as it would synchronise with Apple mail, calendar, and all the other Apple apps.
Here's a link to some pictures taken with my old-generation, 10Mp Google Pixel 3a. They "look digital", but apart from that the image quality is quite acceptable. This picture shows how well computational photography works.
Axel
singleshooter
Like lynn. If you want a good smartphone try IPhone or GooglePixle.
But for parking my alternatives were a different parking place, different grocery or
ordering online
But for parking my alternatives were a different parking place, different grocery or
ordering online
Out to Lunch
Menteur
"what cell phone should a photographer have? I don't buy Apple.
Preferably a brand that guarantees security and other updates for a number of years; Android 11; a headphone jack; 258 GB internal memory, and optical image stabilization.
Some mid-range phones with good cameras:
- Samsung S20 FE (best camera @ $600)
Approximately $500:
- Samsung A52s
- Google Pixel 5a
- Xiaomi 11T
My daughter recently settled for a Samsung A52s. The pictures quality is good.
Cheers and good luck with the parking! OtL
Preferably a brand that guarantees security and other updates for a number of years; Android 11; a headphone jack; 258 GB internal memory, and optical image stabilization.
Some mid-range phones with good cameras:
- Samsung S20 FE (best camera @ $600)
Approximately $500:
- Samsung A52s
- Google Pixel 5a
- Xiaomi 11T
My daughter recently settled for a Samsung A52s. The pictures quality is good.
Cheers and good luck with the parking! OtL
Dogman
Mentor
My phone has a camera. I tend to ignore that.
AAlfano
Well-known
I've been thinking about my smartphone photography a lot lately as I'm considering either buying a Ricoh GRIIIx or upgrading my phone to an iPhone 13 Pro or Pro Max. I have been using the iPhone since the 3G (circa 2008). Since I got an iPhone 4S, the phone has pretty much displaced the digital compact camera for me.
From a photography standpoint, I find the UI/UX of the iPhone much better than any digital compact I've tried (haven't actually had hands-on with the GR yet), although obviously the ergonomics of a camera are better for taking pictures. The phone has a lot of other advantages. First, you're going to bring it with you everywhere anyway, so having the best smartphone camera instead of a separate compact saves you having to carry another item. Also, the lens of the iPhone cameras are more or less sealed against moisture ("Rated IP68 (maximum depth of 6 meters up to 30 minutes") under IEC standard 60529"). This is very important to me as I live in a very hot and humid environment and many times my camera lenses will fog up when going from the air conditioned indoors to outdoors. And I much prefer to compose on the larger iPhone screen than the tiny 3″ screens of dedicated cameras. The actual image area on my 6.1″ screen iPhone Xr using the stock camera app is about 4.3″, so almost 50% larger area than dedicated cameras with 3″ screens.
Some of the better iPhone camera apps like Argentum and Halide at least partially help overcome the phone's ergonomic disadvantages.
If you want to see some amazing iPhone photography, check out Rachel Short's work here: https://www.rachaelshort.com. (some images NSFW).
That said, the iPhone still has a tiny sensor and even Apple's computational photography can't overcome the laws of physics. I find the stock camera app gives images that look overprocessed. Skin tones in particular look blotchy and unpleasant. The 26mm-equivalent focal length of the main camera is a little wider than I would prefer, especially for people photos. I wish they had gone with a 2X lens (52mm equivalent) with a larger aperture for the telephoto camera in the 13 Pro rather than the 3X/77mm equivalent that they chose.
More importantly, I'm becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the smartphone in general and the iPhone in particular. These things are sending out a tremendous amount of information about us and they are NOT good for our mental health. Even Apple, which has painted itself as a champion of user privacy, is beginning to scan its users' photos. Now, it's ostensibly to detect images of child sexual abuse, but what about in the future?
Every time I take my iPhone out of my pocket, I think to myself that every line of code in it is written to maximize Apple's profits (and that of the developer of every app I've downloaded). I feel like every time I use it, someone is trying to sell me a subscription for some service.
Thus I'm struggling between buying a new iPhone to take advantage of its camera and wanting to throw the iPhone I currently have into the cracks of doom.
It's good to know that whatever I decide, my film cameras will be there patiently waiting for me to come back to them. And they don't have any surveillance devices to inform some corporation when I do.
From a photography standpoint, I find the UI/UX of the iPhone much better than any digital compact I've tried (haven't actually had hands-on with the GR yet), although obviously the ergonomics of a camera are better for taking pictures. The phone has a lot of other advantages. First, you're going to bring it with you everywhere anyway, so having the best smartphone camera instead of a separate compact saves you having to carry another item. Also, the lens of the iPhone cameras are more or less sealed against moisture ("Rated IP68 (maximum depth of 6 meters up to 30 minutes") under IEC standard 60529"). This is very important to me as I live in a very hot and humid environment and many times my camera lenses will fog up when going from the air conditioned indoors to outdoors. And I much prefer to compose on the larger iPhone screen than the tiny 3″ screens of dedicated cameras. The actual image area on my 6.1″ screen iPhone Xr using the stock camera app is about 4.3″, so almost 50% larger area than dedicated cameras with 3″ screens.
Some of the better iPhone camera apps like Argentum and Halide at least partially help overcome the phone's ergonomic disadvantages.
If you want to see some amazing iPhone photography, check out Rachel Short's work here: https://www.rachaelshort.com. (some images NSFW).
That said, the iPhone still has a tiny sensor and even Apple's computational photography can't overcome the laws of physics. I find the stock camera app gives images that look overprocessed. Skin tones in particular look blotchy and unpleasant. The 26mm-equivalent focal length of the main camera is a little wider than I would prefer, especially for people photos. I wish they had gone with a 2X lens (52mm equivalent) with a larger aperture for the telephoto camera in the 13 Pro rather than the 3X/77mm equivalent that they chose.
More importantly, I'm becoming increasingly uncomfortable with the smartphone in general and the iPhone in particular. These things are sending out a tremendous amount of information about us and they are NOT good for our mental health. Even Apple, which has painted itself as a champion of user privacy, is beginning to scan its users' photos. Now, it's ostensibly to detect images of child sexual abuse, but what about in the future?
Every time I take my iPhone out of my pocket, I think to myself that every line of code in it is written to maximize Apple's profits (and that of the developer of every app I've downloaded). I feel like every time I use it, someone is trying to sell me a subscription for some service.
Thus I'm struggling between buying a new iPhone to take advantage of its camera and wanting to throw the iPhone I currently have into the cracks of doom.
It's good to know that whatever I decide, my film cameras will be there patiently waiting for me to come back to them. And they don't have any surveillance devices to inform some corporation when I do.
ptpdprinter
Mentor
Anyone making prints from their phone or are you just posting them to the internet? If you are just posting to the internet, then almost any phone will do. I would say the same thing about cameras too. Do you really need a 60MP camera if you are just posting you images to the internet? Is anyone who just posts his photos on the internet really going to upgrade from an M10 to an M11? I am not sure I want to know.
Bill, I am curious. What would happen if you just pulled into a parking space at your grocery store without checking in on your phone? Or what if you did check in on your phone and accidentally pulled into the wrong space? Is there a grocery store employee out in the parking lot resolving disputes? Or maybe a security team with wheel locks and tow trucks at the ready?
Bill, I am curious. What would happen if you just pulled into a parking space at your grocery store without checking in on your phone? Or what if you did check in on your phone and accidentally pulled into the wrong space? Is there a grocery store employee out in the parking lot resolving disputes? Or maybe a security team with wheel locks and tow trucks at the ready?
Austintatious
Well-known
In the not too distant future, the only mobile phone platform that is supported will be 5G. At that point we will all be forced to submit to "Big Brother".
ptpdprinter
Mentor
And what about VHS?
chipgreenberg
Well-known
What type of computer do you use? If you use an Apple there are reasons to get an iPhone such as synching things like the Address Book, Notes, etc. If not, maybe not so important.
Bill Blackwell
Leica M Shooter
The phone is for making calls; carry a camera for taking pictures. The only time the camera in my phone gets used is for incidentals like snapping a drivers license and insurance card after an accident. But my phone's calendar is essential!
You're likely going to need to upgrade to a smartphone eventually as many carriers are no longer supporting basic flip-phones.
You're likely going to need to upgrade to a smartphone eventually as many carriers are no longer supporting basic flip-phones.
Bill Clark
Mentor
Find a place where this requirement to park your car doesn’t exist.
My daughter and her family live near Pasadena and such lunacy doesn’t exist there. Gas for your car is expensive, about five bucks per gallon. I’m wondering when gas will be sold here in the U.S. by the liter?
My daughter and her family live near Pasadena and such lunacy doesn’t exist there. Gas for your car is expensive, about five bucks per gallon. I’m wondering when gas will be sold here in the U.S. by the liter?