X100s/t/f or X-Pro 1?

[M.R.]

Hi, I've read several posts, but still feel the need to ask questions.

Which camera would be best for me? X100 series or the X-pro 1?
(XT-1 /10/20 I'll include as an option as well)

The X100 series seems to have everything I like, except for the focal length. I think I'd miss a 50mm a lot.

At the moment I use a Canon 550D with a manual focus 50mm lens and a 28. I feel I use the 50 most of the time.

So then I go back to the X-Pro 1.
But I read it's quite slow, the AF is slow.
And manual focus lenses are quite a pain with the X-pro 1.

With my 550D I often turn the screen off, and only use it to change the shutterspeed.
That's why I think the Fuji X series would be even better, since there are buttons for all the important functions.

Ideally I could go for both... But I'd still want to know the following:

X100 series, I saw a decent deal for a very abused 100F.
What's more or less the shutter actuation limit? (It has 20K)

X-Pro 1, how slow is it? How good is the AF?
Budget wise I don't have many lens options (with AF).
The XF 50mm F2 WR, is it fast & good?
It seems to have a weird form factor on images I've seen, does it stick out a lot? Is the 60mm macro something I should consider?
Can I frame and shoot with it? Or is it hit and miss more often?

I'll include X-T1, X-T10/20 but I prefer the rangefinder form factor.
Also the OVF is something I might miss.
But the X-T1 /10 /20 has the benefit of being useable with manual focus lenses...

 

[AlexBG]

What do you take photos of mostly?

I've gone, X-t1, x100s, X-e2s, X-t3, X-pro2, X-t3. Mainly shoot landscape and family. The X-t3 actually is smaller width ways than the x-pro2 and so much faster. I missed a lot of family shots with the x100 due to the af.

If you usually shoot a 50mm lens the 35mm 1.4 is a bargain and amazing, that with an x-t1/2 is more than enough for 99% of people.

 

[tbhv55]

The X100 series seems to have everything I like, except for the focal length. I think I'd miss a 50mm a lot.

If you like everything about the x100 series - apart from the focal length - then you might want to consider getting an x100 plus the TCL-x100 converter, which converts the fixed lens to 50mm (effective) focal length. I use it on my x100, and it works a treat. I even like the way it looks (although I know that some people don't).

It's worthy of consideration, at the very least.

 

[Evergreen States]

What’s your budget?

The autofocus experience of the X-Pro1 depends a lot on the lenses you use on it. The 2/50mm, 2/35mm, 2/23mm and 2.8/16mm lenses are newer designs with very fast motors that go a long way in making up for the X-Pro1’s mediocre autofocus system. But all of the older lenses are quite usable.

Here is what you can do to get the most out of the autofocus of the X-Pro1:

1) Find a vertical edge with high contrast in your scene, point the autofocus reticle on it, focus, then recompose. You must find a high contrast edge that is the same distance away from you as the subject you want in focus.
2) Use the EVF. The autofocus is faster and more accurate in the EVF than the OVF.
3) Use AF on the focus selector switch. When combined with the EVF, you can adjust the size of the focus reticle. Adjusting it to the smallest sized box or second-smallest is the very fastest focus possible with the X-Pro1.
4) Alternately, using MF on the focus selector switch allows you to decouple the autofocus from the shutter button, so you can use back button focusing instead. It isn’t as fast or accurate as using AF mode, but allows you to make quick manual focus adjustments in case the camera misfocuses.
a) When using the EVF, pressing the rear scroll wheel once will magnify the focus point. When magnified, turning the scroll wheel will toggle between 3x and 10x magnification. Press the shutter button halfway to return to the 1x full frame view.
b) When using the OVF, pressing the rear scroll wheel once will switch to the magnified EVF view, same as 4a). Pressing the shutter button halfway will return to the OVF.
5) Set Corrected AF Frame to ON in the menu. When using the OVF, this helps give you an idea of where the focus point is after an AF run. With practice, it also helps you predict where the focus point will be before you initiate an AF run.
6) The autofocus works best where there is high contrast between vertical edges. This means when taking pictures of people, the X-Pro1 has been known to focus on the background instead. Compared to human skin, the background is often where the high contrast is. If you have the distance scale set as part of your custom display, you can bring it up when shooting by using the DISP button. This can help indicate if the autofocus ended up in the right ballpark when using the OVF. Regardless of whether you are in the OVF or EVF, the distance scale doesn’t appear in the standard display when using AF on the focus selector, but it does when using MF on the focus selector.
7) Zone focussing is faster than autofocus. It’s best to set the focus selector switch to MF to do this. The distance scale can be set to feet or meters. On all XF and GF mount Fuji lenses (except the 2.8/14mm, the 1.4/16mm and the 1.4/23mm), you can customize whether turning the focus ring clockwise or counterclockwise will focus the lenses closer. Nikon lenses turn one direction, while most other camera brands turn the other.
8) Focusing in dark settings is just going to be slower than bright ones.


I use the Fuji 2.4/60mm on my X-Pro1. Being both a macro lens and one of the very earliest lenses in Fuji’s X mount, the autofocus is very slow and unreliable, but tips 2, 3 and 8 help make it usable. It’s also much, much less trouble on newer camera bodies such as the X-T3. I don’t think you should write off the 2.4/60mm, but a 2/50mm or 1.2/56mm are going to be less frustrating overall.

My experience is that adapting SLR lenses to the X-Pro1 is more trouble than it's worth. Some people have had success with it. I'm just not one of them.

Also worth pointing out a used X-T1 is about the same price as a used X-Pro1. An X-T2 doesn’t cost that much more these days and is better yet. The X-T series is not rangefinder style, but is a better value for the money, having better EVFs and more features than the X-Pro series.

I hope this helps, but knowing your budget would allow us to help even more. I ought to ask if you like using the 28mm on your 550D or would prefer something wider or something between 28mm and 50mm?

 

[jsrockit]

If I had to make a choice based on your thread title... "X100s/t/f or X-Pro 1?" ... I would no doubt pick the X100F... it is the most modern one and has a relatively current processor and decently fast auto focus. The rest are good cameras, but a bit dated at this point. All are ok though... just don't expect fast cameras. The X100T is the next best option. The X-Pro1 has its charms... it is a cool camera, though I prefer the X-Pro2 by a long shot. The X100S would be my last option. The 50mm F2 is fast and great... one of my favorite lenses for Fuji.

I've owned every body you've asked about except the X-T20. No doubt that's an OK body too. With Fuji, you pick your body shape... and then pick the most current option you can afford. It is that easy.

By the way, do not dismiss the X-E3. It is current, small, NEW, AND cheap... and really good.

 

[M.R.]

Wow, thanks for all the quick replies!

What do you take photos of mostly?

I've gone, X-t1, x100s, X-e2s, X-t3, X-pro2, X-t3. Mainly shoot landscape and family. The X-t3 actually is smaller width ways than the x-pro2 and so much faster. I missed a lot of family shots with the x100 due to the af.

If you usually shoot a 50mm lens the 35mm 1.4 is a bargain and amazing, that with an x-t1/2 is more than enough for 99% of people.

I indeed forgot to mention what I photograph.
It's quite mixed / allround. Portrait, Photographing on set, landscapes, product, street, etc.

With a 50mm I was referring to 50mm on aps sensor. (not really fond of 35mm)

If you like everything about the x100 series - apart from the focal length - then you might want to consider getting an x100 plus the TCL-x100 converter, which converts the fixed lens to 50mm (effective) focal length. I use it on my x100, and it works a treat. I even like the way it looks (although I know that some people don't).

It's worthy of consideration, at the very least.

I indeed thought about that.
But it seems very bulky and I read it's quite heavy, also quite expensive for a converter thing.
If there's any similar option cheaper and more compact that might be very interesting.

What’s your budget?

The autofocus experience of the X-Pro1 depends a lot on the lenses you use on it. The 2/50mm, 2/35mm, 2/23mm and 2.8/16mm lenses are newer designs with very fast motors that go a long way in making up for the X-Pro1’s mediocre autofocus system. But all of the older lenses are quite usable.

Here is what you can do to get the most out of the autofocus of the X-Pro1:

1) Find a vertical edge with high contrast in your scene, point the autofocus reticle on it, focus, then recompose. You must find a high contrast edge that is the same distance away from you as the subject you want in focus.
2) Use the EVF. The autofocus is faster and more accurate in the EVF than the OVF.
3) Use AF on the focus selector switch. When combined with the EVF, you can adjust the size of the focus reticle. Adjusting it to the smallest sized box or second-smallest is the very fastest focus possible with the X-Pro1.
4) Alternately, using MF on the focus selector switch allows you to decouple the autofocus from the shutter button, so you can use back button focusing instead. It isn’t as fast or accurate as using AF mode, but allows you to make quick manual focus adjustments in case the camera misfocuses.
a) When using the EVF, pressing the rear scroll wheel once will magnify the focus point. When magnified, turning the scroll wheel will toggle between 3x and 10x magnification. Press the shutter button halfway to return to the 1x full frame view.
b) When using the OVF, pressing the rear scroll wheel once will switch to the magnified EVF view, same as 4a). Pressing the shutter button halfway will return to the OVF.
5) Set Corrected AF Frame to ON in the menu. When using the OVF, this helps give you an idea of where the focus point is after an AF run. With practice, it also helps you predict where the focus point will be before you initiate an AF run.
6) The autofocus works best where there is high contrast between vertical edges. This means when taking pictures of people, the X-Pro1 has been known to focus on the background instead. Compared to human skin, the background is often where the high contrast is. If you have the distance scale set as part of your custom display, you can bring it up when shooting by using the DISP button. This can help indicate if the autofocus ended up in the right ballpark when using the OVF. Regardless of whether you are in the OVF or EVF, the distance scale doesn’t appear in the standard display when using AF on the focus selector, but it does when using MF on the focus selector.
7) Zone focussing is faster than autofocus. It’s best to set the focus selector switch to MF to do this. The distance scale can be set to feet or meters. On all XF and GF mount Fuji lenses (except the 2.8/14mm, the 1.4/16mm and the 1.4/23mm), you can customize whether turning the focus ring clockwise or counterclockwise will focus the lenses closer. Nikon lenses turn one direction, while most other camera brands turn the other.
8) Focusing in dark settings is just going to be slower than bright ones.


I use the Fuji 2.4/60mm on my X-Pro1. Being both a macro lens and one of the very earliest lenses in Fuji’s X mount, the autofocus is very slow and unreliable, but tips 2, 3 and 8 help make it usable. It’s also much, much less trouble on newer camera bodies such as the X-T3. I don’t think you should write off the 2.4/60mm, but a 2/50mm or 1.2/56mm are going to be less frustrating overall.

My experience is that adapting SLR lenses to the X-Pro1 is more trouble than it's worth. Some people have had success with it. I'm just not one of them.

Also worth pointing out a used X-T1 is about the same price as a used X-Pro1. An X-T2 doesn’t cost that much more these days and is better yet. The X-T series is not rangefinder style, but is a better value for the money, having better EVFs and more features than the X-Pro series.

I hope this helps, but knowing your budget would allow us to help even more. I ought to ask if you like using the 28mm on your 550D or would prefer something wider or something between 28mm and 50mm?

For a normal/medium wide type of lens I like anything between 23mm and 28mm. Might even be ok with going wider, like a 21mm if I have a 50mm.

The budget question, I'll discuss below

If I had to make a choice based on your thread title... "X100s/t/f or X-Pro 1?" ... I would no doubt pick the X100F... it is the most modern one and has a relatively current processor and decently fast auto focus. The rest are good cameras, but a bit dated at this point. All are ok though... just don't expect fast cameras. The X100T is the next best option. The X-Pro1 has its charms... it is a cool camera, though I prefer the X-Pro2 by a long shot. The X100S would be my last option. The 50mm F2 is fast and great... one of my favorite lenses for Fuji.

I've owned every body you've asked about except the X-T20. No doubt that's an OK body too. With Fuji, you pick your body shape... and then pick the most current option you can afford. It is that easy.

By the way, do not dismiss the X-E3. It is current, small, NEW, AND cheap... and really good.

Thanks for the info on the 50mm F2.
I also did forget about the X-E3! I'll look into it more.
I'm not too fond of touchscreen though which the xt10/20 series seem to have aswell. Any experience on this? Can it be turned off? Or is it actually really good touchscreen wise?

For the budget question.


I don't really have a budget in mind. I came across a Fuji X-pro 1 second hand for around 175 euro. It had been a while since I saw one at that price range. Most these days are around 250-300.

Since I'll have easy access to the Fuji X-T4 in the future (when it comes out), I thought why not update my own 550 body and invest in a lens, maybe two. That we both can use.
X-T4 for high end stuff, the other personal body for all the rest.

Then I came accross a very used 100F, and starting thinking, doubting and getting GAS all over the place
I'm quite convinced of the X100 series, the quiet shutter seems handy in certain circumstances.
Any info on the max shuttercount for the F / T / S series?

 

[tbhv55]

I indeed thought about that.
But it seems very bulky and I read it's quite heavy, also quite expensive for a converter thing.
If there's any similar option cheaper and more compact that might be very interesting.

In that case - if you're really interested, but uncertain - I'd recommend trying to see/handle one (possibly difficult, I acknowledge, in the current circumstances ).

I had doubts about the TCL before I got mine, but I now actually prefer the appearance of the camera, with it fitted. It's now virtually glued to my x100!

I've mentioned, in other threads on this topic, that the combination looks (to my eye) far better 'in the flesh' than it does in any picture.

 

[Dogman]

Since you now use a 50mm lens (FF equiv. 75mm) and prefer that focal length, you won't find an X100 model that will give you that. The longest focal length conversion lens is 35mm (FF equiv. 50mm).

The 50mm Fujinon lens is one of the sharpest, if not the sharpest lens in the Fuji catalogue, according to Lenstip.com. I agree with them, it's very sharp and it also has a pretty fine rendering of tones as well.

The XPro1 is only slow by the standards of today's speedy AF cameras. You don't indicate you shoot action photos like sports, playing kids and animals, etc., so the slower AF shouldn't be an issue. AF accuracy is fine as is. With the newer ƒ/2 lenses like the 23, 35 and 50mm, the XPro1's AF is not really that slow. Be sure to do all the firmware updates to get the full benefits.

The 50mm is a longer lens than the others in the ƒ/2 group. But it doesn't stick out too far from the camera, especially if you don't use the hood.

The Fuji 60mm is a very sharp lens but its slow AF was a deal breaker for me. Not only was it slow, it hunted for focus. It looks kinda silly as well. Anyway, I sold mine after trying it for a few months. It's the only Fuji lens I ever really hated.

I would also suggest one of the XE models but you apparently like the OVF. I'm in agreement-- I use the OVF of the XPro and X100 models almost exclusively.

If you think you can live with the 35mm equivalent lens of the X100 models, these cameras are gems. I have two X100S's and love them. But I also love the 35mm equivalent focal length.

If you must have a 75mm equivalent focal length and an OVF, the XPro is the only real choice. Everything is a compromise.

 

[helen.HH]

Different thinking...
Get the XE3 ... compact, very affordable, Fantastic camera
More up to date, bang for the buck
Adapt your own lenses if desired with the fotodiox adapters they are great
Or Fuji WR lenses

 

[jsrockit]

Thanks for the info on the 50mm F2.
I also did forget about the X-E3! I'll look into it more.
I'm not too fond of touchscreen though which the xt10/20 series seem to have aswell. Any experience on this? Can it be turned off? Or is it actually really good touchscreen wise?

The touchscreens can be turned off on all Fuji cameras... and I don`t use them, so I can`t comment on how good they are. I use the joystick on the X-E3 to navigate the menus and it works well.

 

[jsrockit]

The Fuji 60mm is a very sharp lens but its slow AF was a deal breaker for me. Not only was it slow, it hunted for focus. It looks kinda silly as well. Anyway, I sold mine after trying it for a few months. It's the only Fuji lens I ever really hated.

I felt the same way about this lens until recently. Now, on modern Fujis, it works really well. The only time it is slow is when you try to focus on a macro subject and then to something far away later. Also, sometimes in low light and low contrast. That said, I`ve used it in the streets and I felt is was fast enough now. And I do not agree about the X-Pro1 only being slow by today`s standards... it was annoying slow when it was released compared to the competition. Of course the firmware updates have helped a lot... but this slowness is something prospective buyers need to know about.

 

[willie_901]

X-Pro 1, how slow is it? How good is the AF?

By today's standards it is very slow. Using it with the newest XF AF lenses with better motors is slow as well. The slowness is primarily due to the in-camera CPU being slow. This means the AF algorithms are less sophisticated than the X-Pro 2 (and other newer X-Series bodies). Also the AF performance in low light is clearly worse. The fact is, the newer bodies are much better for AF in every way.

Still, many of us used an X-Pro 1 successfully for a long time. It takes more work and practice. It is more like using an analog rangefinder. If you know what you are doing, with practice you will enjoy a high success rate. I find the X-Pro 2, and X100T AF lets me concentrate more on composition - especially for candid work where spontaneity is relevant. That said, I still use the OVF and use focus and recompose almost all the time - just as I did with my Zeiss Ikon M and Canon QL17 GIII.

The XF 50mm F2 WR, is it fast & good?
It seems to have a weird form factor on images I've seen, does it stick out a lot?

The 50/2 WR has quick AF and I like the rendering. The rendering is similar to other FUJINON XF primes. I don't have issues with the form factor. The lens is compact and light. The hood is long but at least it is not a petal design.

Is the 60mm macro something I should consider? Can I frame and shoot with it? Or is it hit and miss more often?

The 60 macro AF motor design is unique in the XF series of lenses. The motor and gearing are designed for critical focus at short focus distances. This means using it as a medium telephoto lens can be frustrating as the AF is slow and hunts. Many of us use the 60mm as a medium telephoto lens. But I don't recommend it.

Also the OVF is something I might miss.

The reason I sold all my Nikon gear and switched the original X-100 and X-Pro 1 are their OVFs. I also used a X-T1 for interiors photography gigs. When I stopped doing that, I ended up with a X-Pro 2 and X-100T. Other brands didn't interest me because they didn't have an OVF.[1]

1/ Of course digital Leica Ms and the Epson RD-1 not only have OVFs, they also have analog rangefinders intended for manual focusing. For me they were unacceptable for other reasons.

 

[M.R.]

Thanks all for chiming in!

And thanks for making me consider the XE3


I'm gonna see what I come across, and will choose depending on if the price is interesting or not. If I come across a dirt cheap xpro I might try it.
But the XE3 is definitely on my list now.

By the way, now that we're talking XE, is the XE2 / XE2s worth considering?
I didn't read anything about it being slow or such. The EVF probably a bit dated but should be useable.
Is the AA filter bothering?

Is it correct that most Fuji camera's are rated at around 100K shutter count?

 

[jsrockit]

The X-E2 is ok... it’s not horribly slow or anything. But the X-E3 is just a better camera in every way unless you’re a d-pad fanatic. It’s certainly usable.

Regarding the shutter, I haven’t seen anything but it sounds reasonable I guess.