noisycheese
Normal(ish) Human
I just received the following alert from ASMP regarding Facebook's "new and improved" 
user agreement. Of course, it is new and improved - in a way that benefits Facebook but not photographers.
Take a look at the following web page for a cut to the chase type discussion on Facebook's user agreement: http://asmp.org/fb-tos#.Uioq-caThWk
On to the email I received:
Moral of the story: If you post your photographs on Facebook, expect them to be distributed, marketed, sold and exploited in a manner that brings maximum revenue to Facebook - and no revenue to you.
Why anyone would freely volunteer to be subjected to this type of flagrantly aggressive, obnoxious, arrogant and exploitative abuse is beyond my ken.
user agreement. Of course, it is new and improved - in a way that benefits Facebook but not photographers.Take a look at the following web page for a cut to the chase type discussion on Facebook's user agreement: http://asmp.org/fb-tos#.Uioq-caThWk
On to the email I received:
Moral of the story: If you post your photographs on Facebook, expect them to be distributed, marketed, sold and exploited in a manner that brings maximum revenue to Facebook - and no revenue to you.
Why anyone would freely volunteer to be subjected to this type of flagrantly aggressive, obnoxious, arrogant and exploitative abuse is beyond my ken.
Linkert
Established
I'm speechless.. Really nasty business..
Katie
Established
I'm about to be done with Facebook ... this adds to the list why. I don't want to set a bad example for my kids; as they are approaching the age of computers and have no education of online presence or anything of the likes. With the new facial recognition software Facebook uses; there will be a database of images of you for all the world to browse by the time you are even mature enough to know why you wouldn't want this out there. I refuse to let me kids get on FB or anything like it.
I just received the following alert from ASMP regarding Facebook's "new and improved"
Take a look at the following web page for a cut to the chase type discussion on Facebook's user agreement: http://asmp.org/fb-tos#.Uioq-caThWk
On to the email I received:
Moral of the story: If you post your photographs on Facebook, expect them to be distributed, marketed, sold and exploited in a manner that brings maximum revenue to Facebook - and no revenue to you.
Why anyone would freely volunteer to be subjected to this type of flagrantly aggressive, obnoxious, arrogant and exploitative abuse is beyond my ken.
WOW.
We were working on a way to post RFF's Classifieds on RFF's Facebook page -- NO MORE!
Stephen
Sejanus.Aelianus
Mentor
Why would it come as a surprise to anyone that companies like this are run by greedy people?
What always surprises me, on the other hand, is the huge number of givers on the internet. Open source developers who build really useful software, people who run forums like this, people who put up sites providing really useful information and all for nothing...
Encourage the good guys and shun the Facebooks of this world, would be my advice, which is free.
What always surprises me, on the other hand, is the huge number of givers on the internet. Open source developers who build really useful software, people who run forums like this, people who put up sites providing really useful information and all for nothing...
Encourage the good guys and shun the Facebooks of this world, would be my advice, which is free.
aeturnum
Established
Though I see the claims made by the ASMP, I don't see how the legal language allows them to sell anything to anyone. It says, "You give us permission to use your name, and profile picture, content, and information in connection with commercial, sponsored, or related content" (emphasis mine). That doesn't look like the permission to sell your content to someone else (i.e. no sub-licence). That's not good, of course, but it's not the same as, "any photos uploaded to Facebook may be sold, distributed or otherwise commercialized with no compensation to the photographer."
Also, they mention that the privacy controls have been removed, but the final sentence seems to address that claim as well: "If you have selected a specific audience for your content or information, we will respect your choice when we use it." I'm glad the ASMP is trying to raise the alarm about behavior they're worried about, but I think they've over-stated the effects of the terms update. (Note: I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice)
Also, they mention that the privacy controls have been removed, but the final sentence seems to address that claim as well: "If you have selected a specific audience for your content or information, we will respect your choice when we use it." I'm glad the ASMP is trying to raise the alarm about behavior they're worried about, but I think they've over-stated the effects of the terms update. (Note: I am not a lawyer, this is not legal advice)
Brian Legge
Mentor
The best part is - from interpretations I've heard - Facebook passes on liability to the uploader.
You take a photo of someone and post it on facebook. Facebook sells/licenses the photo to be used by a third party for something commercial. The subject of the photo isn't happy about this and sues. Facebooks ToS evidently puts the unloader on the hook for the lawsuit rather than Facebook itself. Because obviously every photo uploaded has a model release associated with it, right?
Its one thing to lose control of your work and for others to use it without compensation. It another to make yourself legally liable for an unknown, unexpected use.
I pulled all my work off of Facebook a few months ago and won't be posting more there in the future.
You take a photo of someone and post it on facebook. Facebook sells/licenses the photo to be used by a third party for something commercial. The subject of the photo isn't happy about this and sues. Facebooks ToS evidently puts the unloader on the hook for the lawsuit rather than Facebook itself. Because obviously every photo uploaded has a model release associated with it, right?
Its one thing to lose control of your work and for others to use it without compensation. It another to make yourself legally liable for an unknown, unexpected use.
I pulled all my work off of Facebook a few months ago and won't be posting more there in the future.
frank-grumman
Well-known
24,767 comments in response to the request for comments, I didn't read any that said "Gee, Sugarman, great idea." If I could post there I'd be more succinct: "Kiss my ***ey, re* a*****e, whilst taking your Social Network and doing something with it that might likely be painful (or not, as the case may be) "
"
p.giannakis
Pan Giannakis
I tend to ignore emails like these - we see far to much spam nowadays - but this does seem to be true. Therefore I deleted all my photographic work from my facebook account leaving only some everyday snapshots..
frank-grumman
Well-known
Indeed, Sir, I bagged my entire account several weeks ago
sevres_babylone
Mentor
You may be right, but the way I read it is that a sponsor is paying Facebook for an ad, and if they work it out that your picture will help sell the product, that content can be used in the ad with no compensation to you, while FB benefits from being able to offer that content.
My interpretation may be wrong. I'd like to hear all others read this.
Bingley
Mentor
I read it the same way. If your FB content can only be viewed by your "friends" this change in policy may have limited consequences as a practcal matter. But if anyone can see your content, FB deems itself free to use that content for commercial purposes w/out any compensation to you. It kind of underscores that FB is not a "public" space, but a commercial operation that allows users to post, at a price.
Godfrey
somewhat colored
My typical FaceBook allergy just went into itch and scratch mode.
G
G
dasuess
Nikon Freak
Dumped my Facebook account forever after the Instagram debacle. Recently told a relative about the FB terms of service and what FB could do with the photos and personal information they were putting on FB and all I got a dumb look. People just do not realize what the FB's of this world will do with their data and photos.
Roger Hicks
Mentor
Dear Godfrey,
You must have a fairly mild case. What about the boils, pustules, skin sloughing off and difficulty in breathing?
Cheers,
R.
Ezzie
E. D. Russell Roberts
Anaphlylactic shock rather. Experienced it twice, not nice (for those around you).
My problem is that all the athletics and sports clubs my children go to use FB as a means of communication. Soon the schools will be using it. Other public services too. This is getting out of hand.
My problem is that all the athletics and sports clubs my children go to use FB as a means of communication. Soon the schools will be using it. Other public services too. This is getting out of hand.
Murchu
Well-known
Not sure about the new terms, but generally I operate under the assumption that any operators of "free" services are out to monetise me. You can then go two ways, either avoid "free" services altogether, or instead take precautions and use such services in ways that minimise your exposure to their efforts to use you. I'm of the latter persuasion, I go in with my eyes wide open, remain cynical, and take appropriate precautions.
pakeha
Well-known
ha, the ongoing FB angst effects a 'certain' generation again.
Yet, you were happy to use a 'free' marketing tool..oh irony
Yet, you were happy to use a 'free' marketing tool..oh irony
RichC
Well-known
The divide between public and private has been eroding and redefining since Web 2.0 came on-stream. Those in their early 20s and younger grew up with shared online data, and are evolving a very different idea of privacy - in short, anything online will be assumed to be shared, whether put up by them or someone else.
And being online to this age group is essential - as necessary to them as the telephone or letter writing was to previous generations, and just as unthinkable to not use.
It is increasingly accepted by the internet generation that sharing so-called "private" information is the norm - the price to be paid for Web 2.0 and social media like Facebook. - and that they have no control over this information. So, it's pointless caring about what happens to this information - who uses it and how.
It's only older people (as presumably here) who mostly get riled up. Young people are developing new ideas about ownership - three-quarters of the internet generation regularly download pirate music, books and software (plenty of surveys on online for those who care to Google to confirm).
This inevitably affects how young people view copyright: if you put your photo online, don't expect to "own" it!
In summary, if you want to remain a part of modern culture and not end up a victim of the "technological divide" (like my parents who are now feel totally alienated, being unable to operate their old video player let alone cope with the products of the computer age and the mobile revolution!), you'll just have to accept the inevitable and give up worrying about who's doing what with your online data.
How things will pan out in the future, who knows? Perhaps the generation following the internet generation will be even more cavalier about private space, and we end up with "digital communism" - common ownership of data by the majority...
And being online to this age group is essential - as necessary to them as the telephone or letter writing was to previous generations, and just as unthinkable to not use.
It is increasingly accepted by the internet generation that sharing so-called "private" information is the norm - the price to be paid for Web 2.0 and social media like Facebook. - and that they have no control over this information. So, it's pointless caring about what happens to this information - who uses it and how.
It's only older people (as presumably here) who mostly get riled up. Young people are developing new ideas about ownership - three-quarters of the internet generation regularly download pirate music, books and software (plenty of surveys on online for those who care to Google to confirm).
This inevitably affects how young people view copyright: if you put your photo online, don't expect to "own" it!
In summary, if you want to remain a part of modern culture and not end up a victim of the "technological divide" (like my parents who are now feel totally alienated, being unable to operate their old video player let alone cope with the products of the computer age and the mobile revolution!), you'll just have to accept the inevitable and give up worrying about who's doing what with your online data.
How things will pan out in the future, who knows? Perhaps the generation following the internet generation will be even more cavalier about private space, and we end up with "digital communism" - common ownership of data by the majority...
Nomad Z
Well-known
Where exactly does it say this in the facebook terms? What section/subsection? The nearest I can find is...