robert blu
quiet photographer
Apple recently introduced a Mac Mini with the new Apple M1 chip.
It seems to be a powerful tool. With the 8 core GPU more powerful and faster than the previous Mini.
Interesting but I have a couple of doubts: max available RAM is 16 GB and it is not upgradable after the purchasing. And there are only 5 ports total available (2 Thunderbolt/USB4 +2 USBA) and 1 hdmi. Plus the Ethernet.
Maybe because I'm used to the 32GB RAM and the 6+4 ports of my old Mac Pro but I feel this as a limitation in future use.
Any thoughts? Anyone using it with LR or Photoshop?
It seems to be a powerful tool. With the 8 core GPU more powerful and faster than the previous Mini.
Interesting but I have a couple of doubts: max available RAM is 16 GB and it is not upgradable after the purchasing. And there are only 5 ports total available (2 Thunderbolt/USB4 +2 USBA) and 1 hdmi. Plus the Ethernet.
Maybe because I'm used to the 32GB RAM and the 6+4 ports of my old Mac Pro but I feel this as a limitation in future use.
Any thoughts? Anyone using it with LR or Photoshop?
Armoured
Well-known
"It depends." The advantage of the thunderbolt/usb4 is that breakout boxes can work pretty well. Obviously depends on how many ports you need/want in real life use. I think the ports on the mini are more than enough for most uses; those who regularly use more know what the solution is - buy a more (possibly much more) expensive computer, or a breakout box.
As for the ram: yes, a limitation, but you'd have to look at your own use in a bit more detail and account for the much better/faster memory and swap to decide how much of an issue.
I've been following comments from others and I think it's reasonable to say a 'normal' LR/PS user would probably be fine with 16gb. Caveat that 'normal' user doesn't have a half dozen large PS images open at once, three browsers with 40 tabs, with some other large memory hog programs running simultaneously, etc. And, isn't hypersensitive to minor slowdowns or doing a wee bit of memory management work (like quitting a program now and again).
The bottom line is that the memory swap is much faster (to the point that some never notice any impact) and the unified memory helps (for some users, with some programs). System peepers who want to know their machine never uses swap will object.
But: I have some reservations from reading boards and user issues about making final decisions until Adobe puts out an apple silicon version of Lightroom Classic (or at least a bugfixed one).
Long story short, there appear to be some occasional/inconsistent issues reported with memory and Lightroom on the M1. Some guesswork is that there's some coding in Lightroom Classic that doesn't 'play well' with the on-board graphics and unified memory (the hint is that playing with the gfx acceleration preferences helps, sometimes a lot).
Background: I use Lightroom on two Macs, a 24gb and a 32gb Intel, and 32gb is way more than enough, 24gb fine, and the rare cases where more memory might be noticed (on the 24gb) are when I'm hammering it with way more stuff going on than is needed (and even then completely usable). I'm pretty confident 16gb would be fine vast majority of the time even on my slower/less memory Intel machine. (I don't use Photoshop often, using both at the same time obviously would use more memory).
A full-time working pro might very well have a different opinion - lower tolerance for minor slowdowns for one.
YMMV. My personal decision is I'm going to wait before getting a new M1 laptop to see what new models they have (I want Magsafe!) and maybe still splurge for more memory, and also see what user reports say once Adobe updates Lightroom classic.
keytarjunkie
no longer addicted
The Mac Mini was never designed as a powerful desktop machine. It is intended for home use or for spaces a full-size machine can't fit, like on a server rack. The logical upgrade for a Mac Pro is a new Mac Pro, which supports up to a staggering 1.5TB of memory ($$$$$).
My macbook has four TB3 ports and nothing else. I only use one of them, which connects to my hard drive. My hard drive has built-in SD/CF card readers, USB-A, a Displayport connection, and another TB3 connection for daisy chaining other devices. It also charges my macbook. Most accessories like mice, keyboards, and speakers are wireless these days. What else do you need to plug in?
If you're a casual user of LR and PS, 16GB is enough. If you're a professional, you probably aren't buying a mac mini to run your business anyway. The new M1 has gotten great reviews in the macbooks, and I suspect it will be just as effective in the Mac Mini...
majid
Fazal Majid
It's a low-end product. You will have to wait for the higher-end ones to drop in 2021 and 2022. The software will also have caught up by then. That's why the Intel one is still for sale, despite being an overheating resource hog.
The RAM and SSD inflexibility and limitations are because they are literally embedded in the chip to maximize speed. I wouldn't use one for photo or video editing because of the RAM limitation you point out, but I do have the M1 MacBook Air and it is a remarkably fast and responsive machine.
The RAM and SSD inflexibility and limitations are because they are literally embedded in the chip to maximize speed. I wouldn't use one for photo or video editing because of the RAM limitation you point out, but I do have the M1 MacBook Air and it is a remarkably fast and responsive machine.
AFenvy
Established
It performs shockingly well at the price point and form factor that it is at. Strangely enough for an Apple product, it actually is a good value. More than enough for most users although a power user or professional would find its limitations rather quickly.
I’m lazy when it comes to editing and sorting through photos, and Adobe’s Cloud integration of Lightroom works well for me. I dump everything on to my Laptop, it syncs to the cloud, I sort and edit on Lightroom and Photoshop mobile on an iPad Pro, then backup to my desktop. When using Smart Previews Lightroom is as fast on mobile as it is on my desktop, and the only time I see slowdowns is when doing large amounts of image corrections in Photoshop on 150mb+ files.
I’m lazy when it comes to editing and sorting through photos, and Adobe’s Cloud integration of Lightroom works well for me. I dump everything on to my Laptop, it syncs to the cloud, I sort and edit on Lightroom and Photoshop mobile on an iPad Pro, then backup to my desktop. When using Smart Previews Lightroom is as fast on mobile as it is on my desktop, and the only time I see slowdowns is when doing large amounts of image corrections in Photoshop on 150mb+ files.
Plenty of professionals could use this too. Just because you make $ doesn’t mean you’re a power user. Is 16gb good enough for now... most likely for many of us... but he asked about the future.
AFenvy
Established
I agree. Most people go a bit overboard on the future proofing. I’ve edited nearly all of my professional photography on a little Dell desktop with an Intel Core i5 and 8GB of RAM and it worked well enough. Even my old desktop with 16Gb would probably get smoked by the new Mac mini and it’s never let me down even with the largest and most complex Photoshop operations. If you aren’t editing ultra high bitrate 4K video I don’t see a Mac mini ever being a limitation until eventually Apple discontinues support for it and you are forced to upgrade.
Basically, unless you absolutely know you have time sensitive projects that will require enormous amounts of memory in the near future - I wouldn’t concern myself with it.
Basically, unless you absolutely know you have time sensitive projects that will require enormous amounts of memory in the near future - I wouldn’t concern myself with it.
lynnb
Mentor
I'm not hopeful that I'll be able to use my LR6/CS6 standalone license on it. If that changes it sounds a worthwhile upgrade from my late 2012 Mini i7 with 16Gb, which still works fine with image files up to around 200Mb. Not lightning fast, but not slow either.
Godfrey
somewhat colored
- I was able to get hold of the M1 Mac mini for a little raw converter performance testing. An M1 native version of Hasselblad Phocus 2 isn't available yet, but the result of having the new Mac mini with 16G RAM outperformed my 2018 mini with 32G RAM and the i7-six core processor by about 15% running in emulation. (Test was to input 100 CFVII 50c 50Mpixel raw files and output them to TIFF files at the default settings.)
- The new chip architecture is more efficient: watching page swaps with analytic software while running the above test shows they are much faster than the i7-six core. (This difference is what underlies the fact that my 2015 iPad Pro 12.3" when running Phocus Mobile 2 with 2G RAM still feels incredibly fast and responsive.)
- The different port configuration means that I might need a second USB3 hub, that's all. And maybe it's time to buy a new display (my old Apple Thunderbolt 27" display consumes one of my current mini's USB-C ports with a TB/USB-C adapter for its connection).
- Future proof? eh, nothing short of a 100% modular system is future proof. My old 2012 Mac mini is at end of life because it's slow compared to the 2018 mini and I can't run some of my necessary software on the new one under Big Sur (the Lumen app for my now-ancient Light L16 camera—LOL!!) ... But it remains a useful computer because I keep it on an older version of macOS and use it for the things which I can't run on the new one.
I dunno. I'm not buying a new computer just yet: I'm perfectly fine for the level of image processing, video processing, and all the other stuff I do with the 2018 mini I bought last year, so I can afford to hang out for a while yet. The 2012 mini is still running just fine too, and does what I need it for. I'd much rather have one of these than the much larger and more expensive Mac Pro model, they fit on and around my desk much better.
G
Archlich
Well-known
I've got one with 16GB of RAM for painting with Photoshop.
Performance wise it's good, little complain for my intended use. Everything's blazing fast. Ports wise I make do with a USB-C/Thunderbolt dock, which works well enough. Very hard to drain that 40GB/s bandwidth anyway. Adobe software are yet natively ARM but the Rosetta 2 translation runs very smooth, albeit at a ~30% performance penalty (still beats almost all non-pro Intel Macs). This shouldn't be an issue in the long run since native support will come within Q1 this year. There's currently some compatibility issues either with Big Sur or the M1, or both. The one that annoys me particularly is there's something wrong with the M1 GPU's graphic output, that it doesn't recognize the DDC/CI signal from non-Apple external displays. Which means you can't control display brightness etc. with keyboard, can't tweak on the display's HiDPI mode with 3rd party solutions and, calibration software don't work at the moment.
Since the M1 is the baseplate of Apple's entire future PC lineup, I'm sure these glitches will get smoothed out given a bit of time. Still, the Mac Mini is a makeshift product that use the same old chassis, and had I knew better I'd opt for a Macbook Air, which is only a tiny bit more expensive but offers (astonishingly) similar performance, a display and superior portability, which I can make use of. I am curious of what the M1X (or whatever code name they decide to use) chip coming later this year with the new Macbook Pro and likes will be capable of. Might swap the Mac Mini for that one later.
Being able to run iPhone apps seamlessly on your desktop is a hilarious experience. It'll be a good year for Mac users.
Performance wise it's good, little complain for my intended use. Everything's blazing fast. Ports wise I make do with a USB-C/Thunderbolt dock, which works well enough. Very hard to drain that 40GB/s bandwidth anyway. Adobe software are yet natively ARM but the Rosetta 2 translation runs very smooth, albeit at a ~30% performance penalty (still beats almost all non-pro Intel Macs). This shouldn't be an issue in the long run since native support will come within Q1 this year. There's currently some compatibility issues either with Big Sur or the M1, or both. The one that annoys me particularly is there's something wrong with the M1 GPU's graphic output, that it doesn't recognize the DDC/CI signal from non-Apple external displays. Which means you can't control display brightness etc. with keyboard, can't tweak on the display's HiDPI mode with 3rd party solutions and, calibration software don't work at the moment.
Since the M1 is the baseplate of Apple's entire future PC lineup, I'm sure these glitches will get smoothed out given a bit of time. Still, the Mac Mini is a makeshift product that use the same old chassis, and had I knew better I'd opt for a Macbook Air, which is only a tiny bit more expensive but offers (astonishingly) similar performance, a display and superior portability, which I can make use of. I am curious of what the M1X (or whatever code name they decide to use) chip coming later this year with the new Macbook Pro and likes will be capable of. Might swap the Mac Mini for that one later.
Being able to run iPhone apps seamlessly on your desktop is a hilarious experience. It'll be a good year for Mac users.
ColSebastianMoran
( IRL Richard Karash )
I have a MacBook Pro 13" M1 with 8G memory.
With current software, it runs Lightroom on a par with my other Macs, so with next-gen software should be considerably faster.
Battery life is terrific.
With current software, it runs Lightroom on a par with my other Macs, so with next-gen software should be considerably faster.
Battery life is terrific.
willie_901
Mentor
As several others have mentioned, I don't think 16 GB memory is a significant handicap for still photography. Obviously it helps if you don't have three browsers with multiple tabs open simultaneously while you work on image rendering. There are free apps (I use Memory Clean 2) that free up internal SSD space.
If you plan to acquire cameras with 100 MP sensors (e.g. FUJiFILM GFX 100 and 100S) the 120 to 210 MB raw file sizes might tax 16 GB of memory for complex image rendering tasks (color hue and, or exposure blending with multiple images and focus stacking). Working with medium or large format film scans could be even more memory intensive.
I retired my 2012 Mac-Mini (16 GB) and replaced it with a 13" 2020 MacBook Pro (2.0GHz quad-core Intel Core i5 processor, 16GB, 1TB SSD). My 29,000 image LR Classic CC Catalog only uses 1.3 GB; the LR Previews file is usually 10-30 GB. My LR Library folder is 320 GB. My raw file and film scan archives are on external HDs. This leaves about 40% of the internal SSD unused.
I doubt the M1 Mac-Mini ports will be limiting for still photography Archlich mentioned Thunderbolt docks. For post-production work I typically use only one MBP Thunderbolt port connected to a CalDigit TS3 Thunderbolt dock. This dock connects to all my post-production storage, multiple data back ups (6 external drives - 11 GB total) and charges the MBP. It also connects a 2012, 27" Apple Thunderbolt and a 24" Asus PA-246 display to the MBP. Thunderbolt port bandwidth runs all these devices efficiently. Less expensive Thunderbolt dock solutions are available.
If I was a videographer, I would have picked up the top-end 2020 MacBook Pro with more internal memory. My son has one and it is very quick.
I decided not to be on the bleeding edge with a M1 device. Even though the M1 platform is superior, right now I just can't cope with an evolving platform. I realize the Intel MBP will become limiting for post-production work in ~ 3-4 years. By then the M1 platform will be mature and stable.
If you plan to acquire cameras with 100 MP sensors (e.g. FUJiFILM GFX 100 and 100S) the 120 to 210 MB raw file sizes might tax 16 GB of memory for complex image rendering tasks (color hue and, or exposure blending with multiple images and focus stacking). Working with medium or large format film scans could be even more memory intensive.
I retired my 2012 Mac-Mini (16 GB) and replaced it with a 13" 2020 MacBook Pro (2.0GHz quad-core Intel Core i5 processor, 16GB, 1TB SSD). My 29,000 image LR Classic CC Catalog only uses 1.3 GB; the LR Previews file is usually 10-30 GB. My LR Library folder is 320 GB. My raw file and film scan archives are on external HDs. This leaves about 40% of the internal SSD unused.
I doubt the M1 Mac-Mini ports will be limiting for still photography Archlich mentioned Thunderbolt docks. For post-production work I typically use only one MBP Thunderbolt port connected to a CalDigit TS3 Thunderbolt dock. This dock connects to all my post-production storage, multiple data back ups (6 external drives - 11 GB total) and charges the MBP. It also connects a 2012, 27" Apple Thunderbolt and a 24" Asus PA-246 display to the MBP. Thunderbolt port bandwidth runs all these devices efficiently. Less expensive Thunderbolt dock solutions are available.
If I was a videographer, I would have picked up the top-end 2020 MacBook Pro with more internal memory. My son has one and it is very quick.
I decided not to be on the bleeding edge with a M1 device. Even though the M1 platform is superior, right now I just can't cope with an evolving platform. I realize the Intel MBP will become limiting for post-production work in ~ 3-4 years. By then the M1 platform will be mature and stable.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
Future use depends how bad the code of programs you intent to use is going to be written.
The art of coding which gives software with optimized memory, CPU use is getting more and more forgotten.
If you intent is to keep computer for long, then 16 GB top limit might not be sufficient.
Nor it makes sense these days. 16 GB memory max limit is 10+ old technology.
The 250 GB SSD is laughable already. Pricing for storage upgrades of this Mac is just a rip-off. I paid 150 CAF for known brand 1 TB SSD.
In general, if form factor is big factor, then some Intel NUC models looks more reasonable.
The art of coding which gives software with optimized memory, CPU use is getting more and more forgotten.
If you intent is to keep computer for long, then 16 GB top limit might not be sufficient.
Nor it makes sense these days. 16 GB memory max limit is 10+ old technology.
The 250 GB SSD is laughable already. Pricing for storage upgrades of this Mac is just a rip-off. I paid 150 CAF for known brand 1 TB SSD.
In general, if form factor is big factor, then some Intel NUC models looks more reasonable.
Tim Gray
Well-known
I got a 2018 non-M1 mini and it’s been great for PS. I use it with a thunderbolt dock for port expansion. I do have 32 gigs of ram but don’t think I’ve come close to using it all. I’m guessing the M1 will be quite nice particularly when the newer M1 macs get more ram.
About the SSD cost, yes it is expensive and yes I hate you can’t upgrade it after purchasing, but it is SUPER fast. Much faster than my Samsung T5/T7 drives.
About the SSD cost, yes it is expensive and yes I hate you can’t upgrade it after purchasing, but it is SUPER fast. Much faster than my Samsung T5/T7 drives.
benlees
Well-known
Don't get wrapped up in spec sheets. Do you need a new computer- is the old one broken? Chances are you won't tap out even a mediocre machine.
I have an '09 imac with 16GB that I used to regularly scan 100+MB medium format colour files. Never had a problem with speed, but I don't measure time in milliseconds. I'm sure people will chime in to say that THEY do!
I have an '09 imac with 16GB that I used to regularly scan 100+MB medium format colour files. Never had a problem with speed, but I don't measure time in milliseconds. I'm sure people will chime in to say that THEY do!
fbf
Well-known
just a quick note, do not use standard ram capacity to compare with M1 chipped macs. they are not comparable.
The M1 chipped macs are optimized in everyway and it will outperform a lot of the regular pcs out there with much higher rams.
The M1 chipped macs are optimized in everyway and it will outperform a lot of the regular pcs out there with much higher rams.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
In theory. On practice : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6NlyUSGmmU
anerjee
Well-known
I have the M1 Mini (16GB), and use Lightroom classic. Works like a breeze, much better than with any Mac I have used before. I am waiting for the M1 native software to be available, though.
I feel that the Mini is one of the best deals you get in Mac-land.
I also have a 2018 16inch MBP for work (32GB). The MBP is quite unbearable now that I have the M1 machine (noise, performance), and am waiting for when I can move to a M1 machine.
DougK
This space left blank
I have the Mac Mini M1 with 8 GB and it runs blazingly fast, even with Canon Digital Photo Pro 4, which I'm pretty sure hasn't been upgraded or optimized for Apple Silicon yet. It even outperforms my work-issued 2019 MacBook Pro. If you run M1-optimized software, there's just no waiting around: apps open and work instantly. Good enough for my purposes.
charjohncarter
Mentor
Could you post a photo: that would make it a reason to buy it?