Nikon 8.5cm f1.5

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...for comparison

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raid said:
These are beautiful images! The Nikon lens seems to be an excellent lens indeed. I agree that the Summilux 75/1.4 is very different. I have it too.
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Thanks Raid ;-)
The two lenses are actually really interesting to compare.
The few decades between their respective introduction really did not much (if any) in terms of improving optical quality.
In fact as a reaction on the revival of this thread I got curious and did a one to one comparison of shots between my late Canadian v2 Summilux and my v1 85/1.5 Nikkor on a digital M and guess what - they are optically IDENTICAL :eek:
Both show the exact same fine detail, both show the exact same color aberrations we know so well from such fast lenses.
In fact to me it is quite astonishing how much detail the old Nikkor really reveals even wide open at f1.5. Of course if stopping down the Nikkor to say f2 or f2.8 it becomes incredibly sharp and contrasty.

From my experience with the Leitz 85/1.5 and Canon 85/1.5 these never really reach that detail and contrast (biggest difference to the Nikkor though: not even the 75 Summilux can achieve the extremely smooth and creamy background, the 85/1.5 Nikkor can do).

In the 1:1 comparison shots I did, the Nikkor consistently had a bigger confusion of the background compared to the 75 Summilux (as to be expected probably in large part to its slightly longer focal length and very similar light transmission - I could not identify any meaningful difference in exposure between the two lenses from the digital files).

The sample I have, I had to calibrate to perfectly match my Leica gear (I use mine mostly close up between 1.5 - 2.5 meters and have calibrated it that way - remember it is a Sonnar design and will not perfectly match through all distances wide open).

I believe that comments about the Nikkor (or any of those vintage super speed lenses) being "soft" or mediocre in imaging is based largely on the fact that back when these where used on film bodies we simply did not have the fine methods to calibrate these lenses to an identical standard and yes, sample variations are very real with lenses of that vintage - these are hand-built super fast lenses with likely hand ground elements from the 1950's after all.

I was truly surprised to have found how equal the modern 75 Summilux and the mother of superfast portrait lenses perform. I expected the Nikkor to show a higher degree of color aberrations and a softer rendition of fine detail but it doesn't. It really was and is a truly high performance optical design way ahead of it's time.

The 75 Summilux of course brings a host of other improvements:
- much closer focussing
- double helicoid design (the entire lens barrel rotates when focussing the Nikkor)
- much better aperture dial with more precision and easier

But it is neither smaller nor lighter.
A good 75 Summilux nowadays is also A LOT more expensive than a good user copy of a 85/1.5 Nikkor ;-)


uhoh7 said:
Nice post Dirk :)

I always wanted a Nikkor, but I bit the bullet and grabbed the 75 Lux, which you show is so sweet. The Nikkor also looks great.
…
Does anyone know how many Nikkor 85/1.5s were made?
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You did great, any 75 Summilux is a fantastic lens worth owning and using.
The numbers are sketchy. Mostly it is believed there are no more than 2000 units produced in different mounts (often it is mentioned, it has been much less then 2000 but precise numbers are not available).
It is always stated that no more than 500 units have been made in Leica thread mount.

mynikonf2 said:
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8.5cm/1.5 mounted on R2S
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This v2 looks so very clean, it could have as well just left the shop ;-) Beautiful!
Now what confuses me is that your lens' serial number is a little earlier than my lenses (which has the distinct finer ribbed focus ring). My lens came with the black anodized tripod foot though, indicating a later built lens.
Maybe Nikon mixed parts when they built these in batches and used a "v1" optical cell and mount and completed it with a later beauty ring and tripod mount?

Does anyone have a good picture and some info about the proper lens hood that should fit on my v1 sample (two screws in the front rim, which should match a bayonett style hood - I believe the design should be similar to the Leitz Summarex lens hood)

aoresteen said:
I should get the 85mm 1.5 for my SP.....

But for now I'll keep looking for the Canon 85 1.5.
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In my opinion the Nikkor is the more interesting lens as of it's optical performance. Of course of matching a set of Canon glass for collectable reasons is another point …
EDIT: I just see, there is a very reasonably priced Canon 85/1.5 in the classifieds right now (I have no affiliation with the seller).

raid said:
I have the Nikkor 105/2.5 Sonnar, but I don't own a Nikon 85/1.5.
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The 85mm is a wonderful match in performance to the 105/2.5 they fit so well and perform on a similar level at same aperture.
I have a LTM 105/2.5 as well but rarely use it, a I like the Canon 100/2 LTM just a little bit better.

markforce said:
Not sure I would have the patience with the size/weight of the 1.5 so I landed a black 85mm 2.0 in LTM. Happy.
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Mark, no patience needed - the size of the Nikkor 85/1.5 is very often overstated. it is in fact smaller than a 75 Summilux and about equal in size to the latest (very compact) E55 90 Summicron.
The 85/2 Nikkor now is VERY compact for it's focal length and speed - it is not light though ;-)

An interesting tidbit: I was for some years on a hunt after a black 85/2 LTM myself (the sample you bought was obviously a very nice deal - congrats) When I compared my 85/1.5 in a shop against a 85/2 LTM which I was interested in buying I was in for a shock, stopping my urge to buy a 85/2 Nikkor on an instant:

These two lenses are so incredibly close in detail and rendering, that the 85/2 Nikkor (regular silver chrome version obviously) must be the very best bang for the buck portrait lens one can buy in Leica mount. It really is scary how similar they look at same aperture. Congrats on your find - the black 85/2 doesn't come up for sale often (once every other year it seems).
I have seen more 85/1.5 samples for sale than all black 85/2 in LTM.

Here is a shot with the 85/1.5 wide open on the M Mono:

Untitled by teknopunk.com, on Flickr
 
Dirk - great picts and commentary re the summilux

does anyone know how the Nikon 85/1.4g compare to the vintage 8.5/1.5 ?
 
T own the 75/1.4 Summilux and the Canon 85mm/1.5, so adding a Nikon 85/1.5 is not a top priority for me. As Dirk has said, it sometimes is a matter of collecting lenses made by Canon. I had the Canon 35/1.5 and 50/1.5 when I saw a Canon 85/1.5 for sale.
 
marcr1230 said:
Dirk - great picts and commentary re the summilux

does anyone know how the Nikon 85/1.4g compare to the vintage 8.5/1.5 ?
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Thanks Marc! I never used the 85/1.4G myself. I had the 85/1.4AF-D, loved it and in a very stupid moment sold it in order to finance a 50 Summilux.
I am on the hunt to get that 85/1.4D back ever since.
These three lenses are very different from each other, the 85G being an entirely new aspherical design probably having very little in common with he 85/1.5 Sonnar lens (as do the other 85mm Nikkor lenses in F mount).

raid said:
T own the 75/1.4 Summilux and the Canon 85mm/1.5, so adding a Nikon 85/1.5 is not a top priority for me. As Dirk has said, it sometimes is a matter of collecting lenses made by Canon. I had the Canon 35/1.5 and 50/1.5 when I saw a Canon 85/1.5 for sale.
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I can fully understand that Raid - I am more of a Nikon man myself, so I would rather tend to look into the Nikon glass with one very exception:
Canon went and left the rangefinder market with a boooooom and created what I would consider the very best quality lens line up for RF gear from the Japanese manufacturers in the mid 60's. Their all aluminum barrel top of the range RF lenses where simply fantastic for their time. I especially like the 50/.95, 85/1.8 and 100/2 - all simply fantastic lenses. The same vintage all black aluminum 35/2 is a wonderful lens as well - for a reason known as the Japanese Summicron because it simply is just that: a most compact, lightweight and reasonably performing 35mm.

Now is the time to be very honest, stand up and raise your arm who bought that nice looking 85/1.5 Canon LTM form the classifieds :angel:
 
There was a Nikkor 85 1.5 posted on the bay for 1k just yesterday. I love the compactness of the 2.0 and for now, GAS is sufficiently satisfied... In terms of weight between the black and chrome version I'd say it is definitely noticeable to make a difference as to whether I'd bring one, or leave it at home, if that makes sense. Comes down to personal preference I suppose.
p.s. if someone is interested in the chrome version, it is available.
 

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85/1.5 & 85/2

85/1.5 & 85/2

The tale of Two 85's... I usually take the 85/2 on camera, unless I know that I will be shooting in subdued light or want to take advantage of the out of focus signature of the 85/1.5. I also have to consider the extra weight of the 85/1.5, it can make a difference over the coarse of a day (neck & shoulder spasms :eek:).

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Mike, is the filter thread on your 85/1.5 also 58mm ?
Was there a version 1 and version 2 in S mount as well (only difference being the cosmetic design of the controls and the way the lens hood is attached)?
 
85/1.5

85/1.5

menos, there are 2 versions of the 85/1.5 in S mount, the difference is, as you mentioned, the cosmetic design of the knurling on the focus and preset aperture rings. The first version has a fine knurling whereas the second version is a coarser style. Both first & second versions of the lens, in S mount, use 60mm accessory thread and both use a screw on lens hood. Also, there is a third version of the lens that is in Leica screw mount and it uses a 58mm accessory thread and a bayonet mount for fitting the lens hood. The 85/1.5 lens, in all its variations, was made in a black barrel except for one chrome, which only shows up in Nikon literature.
 
Hey Mike, so the LTM versions have all the same bayonet mount lens hood? I have a version 1 LTM sample and am trying to find out more about which exact lens hood it should have come with (mine has two small pins that indicate a bayonet mount lens hood should be fittet).
 
menos said:
Hey Mike, so the LTM versions have all the same bayonet mount lens hood? I have a version 1 LTM sample and am trying to find out more about which exact lens hood it should have come with (mine has two small pins that indicate a bayonet mount lens hood should be fittet).
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menos, the lens hood for all LTM versions, uses a special bayonet mounted, reversible shade, designated: "AB-60" and a slip on lens cap designated: "K-62". So your lens should have come with the AB-60, bayonet mounted, lens hood and a K-62, slip on lens cap.
By the way, the total production of this lens is only 1,353 units and of those 489 were LTM, like yours, 179 were in Contax mount and 685 in Nikon S mount.
 
Thank you Mike, that's great info - too bad these two items are literally impossible to find :-(
 
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