Pixii Really Surprised me

farlymac said:
Why, you say? While you complain about my trying to discuss an issue with a new product? Isn't that what we do here, investigate and question why this or that feature was installed, or whether it is worth the investment?

Come on, if you don't point out certain failings about a new product, then the original CL would not have outsold the M5. You wouldn't get any improvements to the rangefinder flare issue. You wouldn't have IP52 weather/dust sealing on the Q2. And on and on and on.

It is our nature as users of new technology to ask that the functions of a new camera do not deter the ease of use of said product. I'm only saying that if you are going to design and build an APS-C camera, you shouldn't try to use full frame conventions on it just for the sake of marketing. No other manufacturer does what Pixii is trying to do with this camera. It is not a serious camera. It is not capable of standing up to any longtime use no matter how you measure it, whether by ISO range, internal memory (which is the only option), battery life, or rate of transfer to a phone. They are only trying to ride the coat tails of Leica to make money off people who want to walk around with a Leica lens on their cludgy little box.

Cosina would have done a much better job of it. Instead we get a $3300 equivalent of the Yashica Y35. Someone's idea of a photographers camera designed by the marketing department.

PF
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I get it: you don't like the camera or the concept because it isn't what you want, and want to do nothing but look at it from a negative point of view. Fine.

I prefer to look at new products and assess their potential advantages, disadvantages, and differences from other products, rather than look only at what I thing might be a deficiency in the design because they don't fit with precisely what I want.

If you're going to build a camera to use EXISTING M LENSES, it would be insane NOT to set up the viewfinder to be compatible with the most common M-mount focal lengths, regardless of what sensor format you decided to put in the camera. In my opinion, of course. :D

I made and sold a lot of photos with the Olympus equivalent of that Yashica Y35. I wouldn't knock it too much. LOL!

G
 
KEVIN-XU 愛 forever;2973686 said:
I really want to see some real life test shoots. Three pages now but still no picture been shown. Curious.
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There is only one person who has the camera... and don`t you think he needs some time with the camera before posting?
 
Godfrey said:
I get it: you don't like the camera or the concept because it isn't what you want, and want to do nothing but look at it from a negative point of view. Fine.

I prefer to look at new products and assess their potential advantages, disadvantages, and differences from other products, rather than look only at what I thing might be a deficiency in the design because they don't fit with precisely what I want.

If you're going to build a camera to use EXISTING M LENSES, it would be insane NOT to set up the viewfinder to be compatible with the most common M-mount focal lengths, regardless of what sensor format you decided to put in the camera. In my opinion, of course. :D

I made and sold a lot of photos with the Olympus equivalent of that Yashica Y35. I wouldn't knock it too much. LOL!

G
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I don't think you could have, because no one else ever made a piece of crap like the Y35. https://www.yashica.com/y35

And a couple of real world reviews. https://camerajabber.com/yashica-digifilm-camera-y35-review/

https://www.dpreview.com/articles/4...emplifies-everything-wrong-with-retro-styling

If you made money with something like that, then you're a darn fine salesman.

But I digress, G. I reserve the right to express my opinions too, as you have yours, which I wholeheartedly support, for it is through civil discourse that we progress. I have not denigrated you for wanting to like the Pixii, but you feel free to put me down for not liking it. Right now there is only one person on this Forum who has any direct connection to a Pixii, and I await his insightful review. But looking at the specs from the Pixii web page I don't hold out much hope that this is nothing more than some boutique marketing exercise. But don't try to tell me I cannot express my dismay at what was produced by the Pixii folks, especially since I don't see you (in my mind, before you get all literal on me) jumping up and down with $3300 in your hand ready to spend on it.

PF
 
This rangefinder can only realistically compete w/Leica in the pricing arena..
And its too expensive..so ..fail..

Start up company w/no viable QC or service record...
How reliable will this be..
I'm not grumpy or critical of the concept..
Only the price..for what you get..
If it had the A7s 12mp fast sensor in it..
And a card slot..lol..

Well..now... thats..a different story..
I might shell out that kinda bread for that..yes indeedie..

Its always humorous when people are blindly enthusiastic about the latest thing..
w/o any actual proof of anything actually working in said item..for 3.3K..

And..really good at spending others $$$ for them..w/no intention of spending a penny themselves...

I think this company should have done what the replica 8 element company did..
Roll off the 1st batch cheap..and build enthusiasm..
And go from there..
But dont do what the 8 element lens company did..and only deliver a few lenses per month or year..
So pre-orders have to wait until the next lifetime... or 2...(if you believe in reincarnation)..to actually get their lens..lol..
Whilst selling ver 2 for a lot more dough..while ver 1 buyers.. wait to reincarnate..
 
Emile de Leon said:
Its always humorous when people are blindly enthusiastic about the latest thing..
w/o any actual proof of anything actually working in said item..for 3.3K..

And..really good at spending others $$$ for them..w/no intention of spending a penny themselves...
Click to expand...

Wow that happened in this thread? I don’t think I’ve seen one person who wants it or wants someone else to buy it... it’s pretty unanimous here. I think some are sympathetic to the company sure.
 
Originally Posted by Emile de Leon
Its always humorous when people are blindly enthusiastic about the latest thing..
w/o any actual proof of anything actually working in said item..for 3.3K..

And..really good at spending others $$$ for them..w/no intention of spending a penny themselves...
Click to expand...
Wow that happened in this thread? I don’t think I’ve seen one person who wants it or wants someone else to buy it... it’s pretty unanimous here. I think some are sympathetic to the company sure.
Click to expand...
Agreed..maybe I exaggerated a bit..

But with all the gushing..
There has to be a counter balance ..
As in..what if some newbie lookin for their 1st Leica RF..actually reads this thread..
And believes it's a great deal..and shells out the bux..for an unproven product..

All based on the gushing..
I've done this before as a working 20 year old musician in the music industry..bought something based on an industry professionals opinion..and paid the price..later on..
As in...product fails right in the middle of a gig..

The sting of disappointment..when the product doesn't live up to the hype..
Funds out the door..gone..
And no one will take responsibility for it..
I've had this happen with major companies..as well as the fly by nights..
Click to expand...
 
KEVIN-XU 愛 forever;2973686 said:
I really want to see some real life test shoots. Three pages now but still no picture been shown. Curious.
Click to expand...

We saw plenty of images from the Summicron replica!
 
jsrockit said:
Wow that happened in this thread? I don’t think I’ve seen one person who wants it or wants someone else to buy it... it’s pretty unanimous here. I think some are sympathetic to the company sure.
Click to expand...


You should see the comments over at DPR, or Petapixel. RFF thread here is a lovefest compared to those threads, and some others I have seen.
 
I agree Larry... but this RFF... and it is a new rangefinder camera. It doesn’t happen often at this point. But gushing? Where’s the gushing?
 
"Pixii is not simply an alternative option for someone looking for a digital Leica. Some used digital Leicas can be had cheaper, they all have bigger sensors, and – but for the M8 (10mp vs 12mp - big deal!) – are all higher resolution and are higher performing in low light/higher ISOs" ...
- 35mmc

It seems to me you'd be better off with a Fuji X-Pro III with a Leica M adapter - or a used Leica M8!
 
farlymac said:
I don't think you could have, because no one else ever made a piece of crap like the Y35. https://www.yashica.com/y35
Click to expand...

You're correct: I thought you were referring to another inexpensive Yashica camera. That said, I have sold photos I made with a disposable camera on occasion.

A good photographer can make good photographs with any camera at all.

farlymac said:
...
But I digress, G. I reserve the right to express my opinions too, as you have yours, which I wholeheartedly support, for it is through civil discourse that we progress. I have not denigrated you for wanting to like the Pixii, but you feel free to put me down for not liking it. Right now there is only one person on this Forum who has any direct connection to a Pixii, and I await his insightful review. But looking at the specs from the Pixii web page I don't hold out much hope that this is nothing more than some boutique marketing exercise. But don't try to tell me I cannot express my dismay at what was produced by the Pixii folks, especially since I don't see you (in my mind, before you get all literal on me) jumping up and down with $3300 in your hand ready to spend on it.
Click to expand...

Of course you have the right to express an opinion. But when you try to back up an opinion with faulty logic, I have a right to call you on it. Saying that the viewfinder frame line selector is faulty because it doesn't cover your "standard APS-C focal lengths" set is faulty logic ... that's not the intent of the design, at least as far as I can make out. Very few people who have Leica M lenses have the 10, 12, 15, 18, 21, and 24 focal lengths compared to the number of people who have 28, 35, 50, 75, 90, and 135 lenses. So if my intent was to produce a rangefinder digital camera that people who already owned a film M and M lenses, and who wanted a "less expensive" digital body that they could use those M lenses on, the first lenses I'd cover are 28, 35, 50, 75, 90, and 135. Regardless of the format or field of view that differs from the traditional M's FF standard. A new Pixii is about half the price of the least expensive new Leica M digital camera: In that context, it meets the criteria of a "less expensive" digital M camera solution, just like the Epson R-D1 did (and note that it was just about the same price point as the Pixii with fewer features and half the resolution... with the same frame line selector scheme on an APS-C format).

I neither like nor dislike the Pixii. I'm interested in learning more about it because it looks like an interesting camera, to me. And Stephen's first impression was that it was nicely made and nicely packaged. So I'm studying it for a little while.

I'm not jumping up and down with money in my hands wanting to rush out and buy one because I have far more cameras already that cover whatever bases the Pixii can cover and I have no need or desire to add to their multitudes. But if the Pixii's design has some advantages I thought I could use, and I felt the urge, I'd go buy one. Although pricey, it's nowhere near as pricey as my 10, 28, 35, 43, 50, 75, 90 and 135 mm lenses are (any two or three of those lenses cost more). And having a decent body with interesting features that can use those lenses, with rangefinder focusing no less, is always interesting to me.

That the Pixii is expensive and has some limitations I'm well aware, as should be anyone who sees it. What it has that's different or special, without regard to its price, is the interesting part.

I also see no reason to disparage the Pixii folks for their efforts, as you have done. They have their ideas for their product and seem to have been willing to put a lot of money and time into realizing them. Whether the product is successful functionally an interesting thing we have yet to discover. Whether the product is successful in some niche of the marketplace, and not necessarily with either you or me, is another thing that's interesting.

G
—
"You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus."
– Mark Twain
 
A few Pixii noteworthy features

A few Pixii noteworthy features

Pixii is Leica's first digital M rangefinder competition since Epson closed down the RD1. Not even Zeiss, Nikon, Canon, Sony or Fuji have brought digital M rangefinders to the marketplace.

Pixii is Europe's first M mount rangefinder EVER - not made by Leica.

Pixii has a better RF/VF experience than the Epson RD1, Leica M8, or Leica M8.2, or ANY of the classic interchangeable lens Canon, Nikon, Barnacks, Leica copies and Zeiss Contax film rangefinders.

Pixii is by far the quietest M camera shutter ever made, unbelievably quiet. Leica owners have long traditionally gushed over the M's whisper quiet shutter. "There is nothing like the sound of a Leica shutter"
Pixii owners can now gush the same words -- with a completely different meaning...LOL.

Pixii is the ONLY digital M rangefinder currently being made that shows only ONE frameline at a time - without confusing the finder with other frame lines that are not being used.

Pixii is the ONLY M rangefinder camera besides Leica using electronic framelines.

Pixii is the ONLY M rangefinder camera made with a global shutter. That means fast action pics without shutter distortion.

Pixii has by far the fastest M rangefinder shutter speed and flash sync at 1/32,000.

Pixii body is hefty and very rugged. The Pixii was dropped on concrete in a factory test -- 10 times. The body still worked and only needed a rangefinder adjustment.

Pixii is the ONLY M digital rangefinder that will accept your collapsed LTM lenses, no problem!

From a business standpoint, its little short of miraculous that a brand new camera company could possibly bring to market a brand new digital Leica M rangefinder as its first product.
Pixii's most valuable asset is not the camera, its the company expertise which created and marketed a completely new digital M platform.

All of that said, obviously the new Pixii is not nearly the camera the Leica M10-R is.
The Pixii is a radical design not for everyone, fine. I wonder how the Pixii will compare in a few years. Times are changing.
 
ISO 320 Voigtlander 35mm f/2 mostly f/2.8 to f/5.6


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P0000351-2-1600.jpg
 
I'm finding posted bw more pleasing than odd greys from M10M's and Fuji's Neopan emulation.
 
Godfrey said:
You're correct: I thought you were referring to another inexpensive Yashica camera. That said, I have sold photos I made with a disposable camera on occasion.

A good photographer can make good photographs with any camera at all.

Of course you have the right to express an opinion. But when you try to back up an opinion with faulty logic, I have a right to call you on it. Saying that the viewfinder frame line selector is faulty because it doesn't cover your "standard APS-C focal lengths" set is faulty logic ... that's not the intent of the design, at least as far as I can make out. Very few people who have Leica M lenses have the 10, 12, 15, 18, 21, and 24 focal lengths compared to the number of people who have 28, 35, 50, 75, 90, and 135 lenses. So if my intent was to produce a rangefinder digital camera that people who already owned a film M and M lenses, and who wanted a "less expensive" digital body that they could use those M lenses on, the first lenses I'd cover are 28, 35, 50, 75, 90, and 135. Regardless of the format or field of view that differs from the traditional M's FF standard. A new Pixii is about half the price of the least expensive new Leica M digital camera: In that context, it meets the criteria of a "less expensive" digital M camera solution, just like the Epson R-D1 did (and note that it was just about the same price point as the Pixii with fewer features and half the resolution... with the same frame line selector scheme on an APS-C format).

I neither like nor dislike the Pixii. I'm interested in learning more about it because it looks like an interesting camera, to me. And Stephen's first impression was that it was nicely made and nicely packaged. So I'm studying it for a little while.

I'm not jumping up and down with money in my hands wanting to rush out and buy one because I have far more cameras already that cover whatever bases the Pixii can cover and I have no need or desire to add to their multitudes. But if the Pixii's design has some advantages I thought I could use, and I felt the urge, I'd go buy one. Although pricey, it's nowhere near as pricey as my 10, 28, 35, 43, 50, 75, 90 and 135 mm lenses are (any two or three of those lenses cost more). And having a decent body with interesting features that can use those lenses, with rangefinder focusing no less, is always interesting to me.

That the Pixii is expensive and has some limitations I'm well aware, as should be anyone who sees it. What it has that's different or special, without regard to its price, is the interesting part.

I also see no reason to disparage the Pixii folks for their efforts, as you have done. They have their ideas for their product and seem to have been willing to put a lot of money and time into realizing them. Whether the product is successful functionally an interesting thing we have yet to discover. Whether the product is successful in some niche of the marketplace, and not necessarily with either you or me, is another thing that's interesting.

G
—
"You can't depend on your eyes when your imagination is out of focus."
– Mark Twain
Click to expand...

I don't think logic comes into play here. I'm not buying a camera based solely on the type of lens mount it has. I'm looking at the overall picture. Granted, the makers of Pixii had to make compromises in order to keep to a predetermined form factor for the body, but I think they went too far. No removable data recording media (SD or CF card), no removable battery (if it goes bad you have to return the camera), you need a smart phone and app to be able to download the internal memory (something else to have to haul around).

A little more real estate in the body would have allowed room for a card holder and removable battery, plus a USB-C connector to eliminate the smart phone requirement. But they were more interested in making a pretty little camera, and slapped an M mount on it because they want to tap a market where folks supposedly have deep pockets full of cash.

I have a lot of reasons why I buy Leica cameras and lenses. Mainly because they are better than the clones I started using to see if I would like the originals. But that's it. If the lenses were junk, or the bodies didn't fit my hands, I never would have bought into the system. And it's not like I'm made of money either. There are plenty of lenses and bodies I'll never blow money on because they are just so darned expensive (well, maybe if I win a lottery...oh wait, I don't even buy lottery tickets).

You know, Cosina didn't think there was a market for a new digital M rangefinder camera. If there was, and they had built one, I'm sure it would not have been like the Pixii.

PF
 
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