Shoot a camera, not a gun

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frank-grumman said:
Gee, Sparrow, what, are trying to start an argument? I don't know about other cultures, I don't prescribe for them what to do or how they should live their lives, or organize their laws with respect to firearms ownership. Do as you want. I may think of what the EU does as nuts so far as firearms ownership is called, or Japan as stupid, or Australia and NZ as idiotic, but, end of the day, it's none of my business. I don't live there, and I'm sure folks who do are quite pleased with the way they find it. I've often invited folks who don't like the US, to leave. I however will be staying :) Not sure who said, but it went something like "you makes your choices and you takes your consequences." I'm fine with that. :)
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Highlight 1: Unfortunately it rather looks as if you don't want to know, or to consider the possibility, that there are other ways of doing things -- possibly better ways. And, it has to be said, possibly worse. That's the point of rational discussion: to investigate others' points of view.

Highlight 2: Actually, just a variant on Highlight 1. Have you no better arguments than "My way or the highway"?

There's a Spanish proverb, "Take what you want, and pay for it, saieth the Lord." Just don't ask other people to pay (sometimes with their lives) for what you want. Consider what they might want, too. There are quite a few possible interpretations of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness."

Cheers,

R.
 
E__WOK said:
Your question is nonsense. No, school children should not be armed. The only way to protect them is to have trained adults (teachers or security guards) be there in case something does happen.

Better yet, we should close all schools and force them to be home schooled. This way, much fewer children will die. How does that sound to you?
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Fine ... knives in aircraft hand-luggage, teachers and security guards with side-arms, what could possibly go wrong?
 
E__WOK said:
Then you tell me what is the cause of all these shootings and how to prevent them without taking the guns away from the civilian population?
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Maybe you should read the thread before making 500 replies if this is the question you're asking just now. ;)
 
Sparrow said:
Fine ... knives in aircraft hand-luggage, teachers and security guards with side-arms, what could possibly go wrong?
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Fine. Disarm or prevent teachers and security guards the means to defend and protect the lives of others and we will get more Sandy Hooks.
 
In my home town we have cops all over town with radar guns. Since the economy has went south and taxes are not coming in the local Gov't has seen fit to raise revenue by passing out speeding tickets. It has gone way past public safety and into the harassment area. If the cops were protecting the schools instead a gunman couldn't get in the school in the first place. We can spend several billion putting a rover on Mars surely we have the money and technology to keep gunman out of schools.
 
E__WOK said:
Then you tell me what is the cause of all these shootings and how to prevent them without taking the guns away from the civilian population?
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... thats easy, they are caused by unstable people having the means of killing many people quickly ...

... one prevents that happening by removing the one from the other
 
cosmonaut said:
In my home town we have cops all over town with radar guns. Since the economy has went south and taxes are not coming in the local Gov't has seen fit to raise revenue by passing out speeding tickets. It has gone way past public safety and into the harassment area. If the cops were protecting the schools instead a gunman couldn't get in the school in the first place. We can spend several billion putting a rover on Mars surely we have the money and technology to keep gunman out of schools.
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Cops are not there to protect schools.

Why are the cops looking for speeders instead of more dangerous people?

If Adam Lanza didn't have a car, he wouldn't been able to get there from his house.
 
digitalintrigue said:
What good is an unarmed security guard?
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One huge advantage is that he cannot perforate the plane's hull or tanks. Shooting inside a plane is quite a bad idea, even more so at altitude. And he will have better martial arts skills than the flight attendant...
 
Sparrow said:
... thats easy, they are caused by unstable people having the means of killing many people quickly ...

... one prevents that happening by removing the one from the other
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This ain't Utopia. Violence is the way of life since the beginning of time. Should we ban the use of rocks and tree branches?

The guy was crazy and should have been locked up.
 
sevo said:
One huge advantage is that he cannot perforate the plane's hull or tanks. Shooting inside a plane is quite a bad idea, even more so at altitude. And he will have better martial arts skills than the flight attendant...
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That's why we have Federal Air Marshall who are the best shooters bar none.
 
sevo said:
One huge advantage is that he cannot perforate the plane's hull or tanks. Shooting inside a plane is quite a bad idea, even more so at altitude. And he will have better martial arts skills than the flight attendant...
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Who put the security guard on a plane? I thought we were talking about teachers, and 'security guards with side-arms' (which is really redundant.)

(BTW, we do have pilots that are armed...do we not? And Federal Air Marshals...)
 
wolves3012 said:
Fascinating discussion for a camera site, unlike many another OT thread, this one has remained reasonably calm.

As someone in the UK, where gun crime is relatively low and guns are rarely seen in day-to-day life, I'm intrigued as to why americans are paranoid enough to feel the need to defend a right to carry guns. Is it really so unsafe and is that not actually just linked to the high gun ownership?

I see the idea of some comfort in the perceived ability to defend yourself but why the ready access to weapons far beyond actual need? It's been known for crackpots to go on the rampage with a (military) tank but does anyone advocate the need to own an anti-tank missile launcher in the house, "just in case"? Surely, the removal of overly powerful guns from general society can't be argued to be a Bad Thing. I accept that a small number of people have legitimate reasons to own these things but self-defence is surely not legitimate. Pest-control, people in danger from wild animals etc, yes.

If, as one poster says, you can keep your proficiency by using airsoft pellet guns, paintball guns etc, then why not limit yourselves to such non-lethal machinery for "sport" purposes? You can't legislate the crackpots and criminals out of existence, any more than terrorists and similar threats but surely you *could* legislate to mitigate their acts on society.

I am puzzled by the gun-culture in countries like the US, maybe I just haven't seen enough of the world to understand!
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Maybe you didn't read my previous post. In the US there is a very high chance your house will be robbed in your lifetime. I am 53 and have been broken into twice. A growing trend in my area is home invasions while you at home. It has happened several times in the last few years. One couple was shot execution style after being held for hours. The perps were wanting money CCs and pin numbers.
A friend and co- work of mine awoke in the middle of the night to find a man in his house.
My wife has been physically attacked twice, years apart and different men. Also years ago when I was a teen we had an intruder come into our house in the middle of the night and it was a man that had been stalking my younger sister and was wanting to get her to go off with him. She was 12 and he was 20. He was caught and nothing ever done about it. But this was the 70s.
It is what I have seen and grew up in that makes me be protective. I have an a99 and CZ 28-70mm lens when I am out shooting. Someone would bust my head and take it from me in an instant if I were to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's the culture I live in.
 
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