aizan
Mentor
now, if ricoh put an evf in the gr digital and went DOWN to a 1" sensor, i'd call that a pair of leather boots.
zuikologist
.........................
I long ago gave up on film for this purpose and use a Ricoh grd iv or a Sony NEX with pancake 20/2.8.
p.giannakis
Pan Giannakis
the fuji tiara ii/cardia mini/dl super mini has a 28mm f/3.5 lens, and it'll only cost about $250-350.
I had one of these. Great camera, very good lens but i would never pay this amount of money to get it (i paid a couple of pounds in a car-boot sale).
Want a good and cheap p&s? Konica A4
DKimg
Established
The Fuji Klasse S/W looks more appealing with its specs but like others have mentioned, I don't like the current prices of what they are.... a bit steep. I do have a beater Fuji Tiara with a broken cover door and no battery lid... but it works, functionality wise, and it does produce good photos. Bargain for ~$56 ... Very pocketable.... Like previous comment... can get them in the $240 average (Tiara I and II are pretty much the same).
NaChase
Well-known
I love my Nikon 28Ti. They are typically cheaper than Ricohs and the Fujis too.
13Promet
Well-known
As long as you're operating in external daylight, appllying sunny 16 is much, much easier than you're anticipating.
After two rolls training at it, you'll be done.
Moreover, it's way quicker and more accurate than any auto metering camera, wich requires thinking about what part of the frame is actually being metered and often needs compensation.
This is especially true if you're shooting 400 ASA BW negs, which are quite tolerant to exposure mistakes.
Early 2000s high-end P&S are now luxury disposable toys: perfectly fine if you can afford them or find them for a bargain price, much less if you pay full for them while being on a budget.
Ko.Fe.
Lenses 35/21 Gears 46/20
Barnack is 300, SC is 400, plus old Canon 28 for another 100.
So, none of the free.
XA4, it is not going to last longer than GR or W, but it is 200.
And no pockets, please, it trashes those camera quickly.
Get small belt pouch and use wrist strap. Pull camera by the strap and while it goes from the punch, front cover slides off.
So, none of the free.
XA4, it is not going to last longer than GR or W, but it is 200.
And no pockets, please, it trashes those camera quickly.
Get small belt pouch and use wrist strap. Pull camera by the strap and while it goes from the punch, front cover slides off.
FalseDigital
krapow moo khai dow
As much as I love the quality of GR lenses, they are fragile machines. I don't believe anyone can repair them at the moment either. So that being said, I'd have to recommend the Fujifilm Klasse over the GR.
mod2001
Old school modernist
Sadly yes, otherwise I would add a GR21 to my Contax T3. I had 2 GR1V and 1 GR21, all died in between 3 years after purchasing. And even the digital GR's are very prone to failures, my GRDiV failed as also did my GRI a few weeks ago which I sold to a friend in 2017. Luckily he still talks to me as he's also using my old Contax T2 w/o any issue.
Regarding service, the LDC failure can be fixed by yourself though its quite delicate work. For the motor, there's a guy in Portugal who's specialized on this topic. But don't know if he fixes or just replaces the motor. Anyway, you find him on eBay. Regarding the Contax P&S, a small company in Germany (http://www.tritec-service.de/index.php/kontakt/impressum.html)) can still fix a lot of things, they also provide a normal overhaul, cleaning the lens and electronic contacts and so on, they even replaced my 1 tooth film spool with the more reliable 2 tooth version 3 years ago.
Strange, I stash it in my jeans/jacket pocket since years every day multiple times, no issue at all. Imho the best and most reliable electronic P&S ever and for sure the best buy ever in my photographic life. Its the only camera I would never ever sell again.
Yes, there are a lot of cheaper alternatives with 28mm but none of them comes close to the GR1, probably the Minolta TC-1 as second and the Nikon 28TI as third choice. Never tried the Fujifilm Klasse so can't say, but the reviews look also quite promising. The rest, well, I tried a lot of them, no fun at all, fiddly, slow, mostly mediocre lens and so on. Same in the 35mm league, T3 (T2 to some extend) is not to beat (hence the high prices), putting the Nikon 35TI with the flash selector of the 28TI on second place.
Regarding the high prices, forget eBay and especially the crazy Japanese offers, try to find them locally, much cheaper if you look long enough and you also have chance to try it first, in case of the GR it's definetely highly recommended.
Juergen
Huss
Mentor
I had a T3 a while back, and wished I didn't sell it. But man, my Rollei QZ35W is something else. 28-60 lens, titanium construction, Porsche design, 1/8000 sec shutter...
Size of a Leica M9 though!
Size of a Leica M9 though!
mod2001
Old school modernist
Huss
Mentor
I have the AF600/LiteTouch and the lens is excellent on that tiny camera!
kiss-o-matic
Well-known
Late to the game, but I sold my GR1v recently. LCD worked perfectly, but there was an annoying light leak. Even disclosing the light leak, I got very close to what I paid for it after shooting a good 20-30 rolls, so not a bad investment. Great lens. Too bad it's made like ****.
Not sure there is anything that can be said here that hasn't been said. If you must have 28mm and zone focusing another one that may be worth considering is the Olympus XA4. Great lens. Not super expensive. The focusing system takes a bit to get used to but it's dope.
Anyway, while it's cool to point out obvious price hikes, the real question is if the prices will stay that way or not. If they do, and you want the item, you'll have to face the music at some point. Of course, nobody knows, but my mind always points out that these cameras, nor anything similar, are made any more. Also, film photography has seen a surge, as have other non-digital forms of entertainment, with new users entering the market regularly.
During my tenure in Japan, my other life enveloping hobby was retro video games. You think something doubling in price is bad? Try adding a zero to a console game that previously cost $50 - $100. Arcade PCBs are even crazier. There's a similar formula: Millennial nerds now have money as generation X did in the early 00's, coupled w/ the fact that packaged products are becoming few and far between. Forces collectors to hit the back catalog.
Not sure there is anything that can be said here that hasn't been said. If you must have 28mm and zone focusing another one that may be worth considering is the Olympus XA4. Great lens. Not super expensive. The focusing system takes a bit to get used to but it's dope.
Anyway, while it's cool to point out obvious price hikes, the real question is if the prices will stay that way or not. If they do, and you want the item, you'll have to face the music at some point. Of course, nobody knows, but my mind always points out that these cameras, nor anything similar, are made any more. Also, film photography has seen a surge, as have other non-digital forms of entertainment, with new users entering the market regularly.
During my tenure in Japan, my other life enveloping hobby was retro video games. You think something doubling in price is bad? Try adding a zero to a console game that previously cost $50 - $100. Arcade PCBs are even crazier. There's a similar formula: Millennial nerds now have money as generation X did in the early 00's, coupled w/ the fact that packaged products are becoming few and far between. Forces collectors to hit the back catalog.
All of them are ticking time bombs with huge prices unfortunately.
Out to Lunch
Menteur
I've never understood the interest in the Klasse W. They've had a bad reputation...unreliable...frequent breakdowns and I suppose that today you can't service them any longer.
Huss
Mentor
They do? hmm never heard that (not saying u r not correct).
Pál_K
Cameras. I has it.
On the contrary, learning the basics of evaluating a scene, anticipating the moment, and setting the exposure beforehand, might add to your enjoyment. Unless you're using transparency film, there's enough latitude in film to make a very good print with detail in the highlights and shadows.
Archiver
Mentor
One of my flickr friends bought a Klasse very shortly after it was released. He said that it was a decent camera, but overpriced even at that time. With the talk of Klasses giving up the ghost with disturbing commonality, I would look for an Olympus XA4 or two, which will give you an autoexposing 28mm film camera that you can pocket. The alternative is a mechanical M body with a compact 28, maybe a M4-P and a Voigtlander 28mm f3.5 LTM with adapter. This is still fairly compact and can go in a small bag.
I am increasingly wary of expensive film cameras that rely on electronics, from compacts to rangefinders. I've been lucky with my compacts like the T3 and Natura Black, but my Zeiss Ikon just bricked itself one day, and I have to see if it's fixable. I'll continue to use my M7, but it would not be a good thing if the electronics packed up. The more expensive the camera, the more I'm inclined to be concerned about repair costs or feasibility.
I am increasingly wary of expensive film cameras that rely on electronics, from compacts to rangefinders. I've been lucky with my compacts like the T3 and Natura Black, but my Zeiss Ikon just bricked itself one day, and I have to see if it's fixable. I'll continue to use my M7, but it would not be a good thing if the electronics packed up. The more expensive the camera, the more I'm inclined to be concerned about repair costs or feasibility.
Ted Striker
Well-known
Nonsense. The Klasse was $400 when it was in production. That's an excellent price and one I would pay EASILY if still available. The lens on the Klasse cameras was top notch and the build quality just as good. I held a Klasse S in my hands while in Tokyo years ago and deeply regret passing on buying it brand new for $388. What an epic fail on my part.
leicapixie
Well-known
Sorry you are wrong!
Mindless shooting yields few good images, even if lucky.
One must/should have an idea of the photo you want.
Anticipating, searching and waiting ..
Manual exposure is not "Astrophysics".
Film has wide tolerances.
I shot old Tri-X in steps from 10 ASA to 1600 ASA (almost ISO).
I made small prints of all..
Reasonable prints throughout!!
Get a good camera, Barnack or any decent mechanical.
You will get joy as you learn..