Bingley
Mentor
I'm delighted to see this new forum and am excited to meet the mentor and learn from him. I liked the photos posted by the head bartender, some of them very much. As for the bickering, well, it's so RFF... but I've seen worse.
raid
Dad Photographer
Some things have been said that should have been said differently maybe. Move forward and let things be gone. Now the purpose of the thread is known.
gb hill
Mentor
Sad to say but Mr. Frank Jackson is a name unknown to me as a photographer. I for one enjoyed the photographs posted by Stephen & I look forward to participating in this forum. Again thanks to Stephen for setting this forum up for those of us who enjoy street photography.
bohdan
-- Physicist
I am thinking of starting a separate thread on this topic. Me, I enjoyed the photos. There's one where the subject is photographed from behind smack dab in the middle of the frame. As a person with a cinematography and animation background, I was jarred. It was a symmetry that drives me crazy. But, the photographer pulls it off. There's more story going on that kept me busy as if I were the one observing the scene. It worked for me.
You see, I spent years as a flight instructor after ejecting from hollyweird. One of the things that I learned was how to critique. If I said, "sir...you are a mediocre pilot" or even "your flying is so so" -- I'd lose that client. It's negative. It serves no purpose. It serves only to degrade the person.
We have to be careful as pilots because it can also be a stressful environment. I teach aerobatics, and that involves a lot of time upside down. There's a lot of stress in that for a pilot that has never experienced it. If I were to say 'your flying just doesn't fit my style', I wouldn't make an impact. We have to be careful to keep everything positive. If there are hazardous behaviors, we use language that is very pointed, but non-accusatory. In other words, we differentiate between saying: "you flew that stall incorrectly" and "that stall needs a bit of work". One is personal saying "you are inadequate", the other is dissociated, saying this item needs to be fixed. Correct the behavior, not the student.
I spent time in two Art Schools (both in Chicago -- finished at CCC), and had to get some pretty thick skin. When I got to hollyweird, most people were helpful. The worst I ever heard was: "there are some things in your portfolio that are not appropriate". A nice way of saying I needed to edit better. Furthermore, I found that the most successful critiques were those with a purpose. You see calling someone's work mediocre, for me at least, makes me want to reply...okay, let's see yours then smart guy. I am the one with the skin in the game. I was the one that let my work be shown. I was the one that showed courage.
So, what is the purpose? Do we want to say "yeah, your work is just okay?" Or do we want to build people up? I am 46, and I fly upside down for a living. There is not much you can do to hurt my feelings when it comes to photography. What about an 18 year old who is in their artistic infancy? My favorite site is Eric Kim. He attracts some of the biggest d-bags on the planet. Internet trolls. I don't agree with Eric photography practice, but I would never bust his balls for it.
For instance, look at his flash photos of Japan. He has taken that portfolio down, but it made me uncomfortable. In my opinion, it's a classic case of the Hawthorne Effect. If you want to show a lot of unhappy Japanese, walk around Tokyo with a Leica and a Flash and set it off in peoples faces. You are going to get that kind of reaction, from a stoic people, if you do that. What would I think would help him in his photography at that time? Try this approach: observe, don't interfere. He may have intended on the viewer feeling uncomfortable. If that is the case, there may be more effective ways of doing that. Either way, it's good that he is learning. Not to mention, there are tons of positive things you can come up with that he did that works. Look folks, the photo either 'reads' or it doesn't.
Some of the worst critiques came from the bitter, washed up artists. I think they thought they were doing us a favor. It was horrid. Served no purpose other than to drill us down. Nothing constructive. I've had Chief Pilots that were friendlier. So, some may think they are being helpful and honest by stating what they think is the truth. It honestly serves no purpose.
So here is my critique for your critiques.
1. Say something worthwhile -- if you have a point, make it and back it up with data
2. One sentence critiques are not worth the trons that they are printed on, be constructive
3. Anyone can take pot shots, remember that this photographer took a chance in displaying his work. Respect that.
Thanks Mr Gandy for having the forethought to share Frank's work. Thanks Frank for doing what you do. I'll be keeping an eye out for you.
You see, I spent years as a flight instructor after ejecting from hollyweird. One of the things that I learned was how to critique. If I said, "sir...you are a mediocre pilot" or even "your flying is so so" -- I'd lose that client. It's negative. It serves no purpose. It serves only to degrade the person.
We have to be careful as pilots because it can also be a stressful environment. I teach aerobatics, and that involves a lot of time upside down. There's a lot of stress in that for a pilot that has never experienced it. If I were to say 'your flying just doesn't fit my style', I wouldn't make an impact. We have to be careful to keep everything positive. If there are hazardous behaviors, we use language that is very pointed, but non-accusatory. In other words, we differentiate between saying: "you flew that stall incorrectly" and "that stall needs a bit of work". One is personal saying "you are inadequate", the other is dissociated, saying this item needs to be fixed. Correct the behavior, not the student.
I spent time in two Art Schools (both in Chicago -- finished at CCC), and had to get some pretty thick skin. When I got to hollyweird, most people were helpful. The worst I ever heard was: "there are some things in your portfolio that are not appropriate". A nice way of saying I needed to edit better. Furthermore, I found that the most successful critiques were those with a purpose. You see calling someone's work mediocre, for me at least, makes me want to reply...okay, let's see yours then smart guy. I am the one with the skin in the game. I was the one that let my work be shown. I was the one that showed courage.
So, what is the purpose? Do we want to say "yeah, your work is just okay?" Or do we want to build people up? I am 46, and I fly upside down for a living. There is not much you can do to hurt my feelings when it comes to photography. What about an 18 year old who is in their artistic infancy? My favorite site is Eric Kim. He attracts some of the biggest d-bags on the planet. Internet trolls. I don't agree with Eric photography practice, but I would never bust his balls for it.
For instance, look at his flash photos of Japan. He has taken that portfolio down, but it made me uncomfortable. In my opinion, it's a classic case of the Hawthorne Effect. If you want to show a lot of unhappy Japanese, walk around Tokyo with a Leica and a Flash and set it off in peoples faces. You are going to get that kind of reaction, from a stoic people, if you do that. What would I think would help him in his photography at that time? Try this approach: observe, don't interfere. He may have intended on the viewer feeling uncomfortable. If that is the case, there may be more effective ways of doing that. Either way, it's good that he is learning. Not to mention, there are tons of positive things you can come up with that he did that works. Look folks, the photo either 'reads' or it doesn't.
Some of the worst critiques came from the bitter, washed up artists. I think they thought they were doing us a favor. It was horrid. Served no purpose other than to drill us down. Nothing constructive. I've had Chief Pilots that were friendlier. So, some may think they are being helpful and honest by stating what they think is the truth. It honestly serves no purpose.
So here is my critique for your critiques.
1. Say something worthwhile -- if you have a point, make it and back it up with data
2. One sentence critiques are not worth the trons that they are printed on, be constructive
3. Anyone can take pot shots, remember that this photographer took a chance in displaying his work. Respect that.
Thanks Mr Gandy for having the forethought to share Frank's work. Thanks Frank for doing what you do. I'll be keeping an eye out for you.
Last edited:
Keyne
Established
Thanks Stephen. I was wondering what cameras and film/digital were used. Interesting to see the deifferences.
Shac
Well-known
Bohdan P ++1
fotographz
Established
fotographz
Established
...as a matter of fact my favorite lens is a 50mm on 35mm systems and 100 mm on medium format . I happen to like the angle of view and as I'm not a fan of zoom lens I mostly will get closer...
JP Owens
Well-known
In my personal stuff, I tend to favor a 50mm or 85mm. When I'm shooting a 24 - 70 zoom, I find myself at the long end of the zoom most of the time. I like to isolate a subject, rather than locate the subject in an environment.